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EVA SLATTER DANIELS: Well, is it ready to go now?
SAM SCHRAGER: Yeah, just forget about that.
ED: (Laughs) Uh, let's see. Well, my father's name was Jacob Slatter,anyway but he always wrote his name "Jake". He didn't care particularly for the "Jacob" I guess, or maybe it was too long to write, and he was born in New York City. And when he was, I'd say six years old his uh father and brother were killed in a brawl, and somewhere between six and seven, his mother passed away. He had a little sister born, and his mother passed away. And so the girls were really, too the older girls, were really too young to take care of two little children like that so they decided to send those two to the orphans home. And they called the orphans home and the man came to get these two children, and he was driving a. team. And here he was holding a baby and a little boy sitting bnside him and all at once the little boy was missing. Well, he didn't dare leave the team and he was h a baby he couldn't run very far,so he had to wait 'til he got the baby to the orphans home before he could give a notice and go look for the little boy, and by that time,my father had escaped far enough that they find him. And he told us afterwards that he'd hid under porches and behind garbage cans and in barns and under hay and everyout thing, but anyway he escaped and got fito Pennsylvania and then on down through to the Southern states, not really way Southern, but Indianna, Illinois and on. He was in Texas little while, and from there he went on to Missoura. And while he was in Hissoura, he got a job with, uh, I guess yju'd call her a spinster. She was, I suppose, about thirty years old. And it was thrashing time. He was to put straw into the steam engine. And so all the other young men around there had straw hats, and, of course, he thought/uf he was big enough to work, he was big enough to have a straw hatA Well she "Hhat out and bought him a straw hat. And very soon after that, he lost the straw hat and got a very long scar on the back of his head. He ran, he went to duck under the belt. And it hit him and flipped him, and he hit something,Phe wasn't big enough to know what. But anyhow, it always did hurt him worse that he got the, that he lost his straw hat instead of the scar.
SAM: We're talking about a kid who's running away when he was six yearsold at this time
ED: Yes, well he was about seven, or maybe a little over seven because you see,he'd come through that many states, it probably took him a year or so to get that far.
SAM: Ifind it amazing thahe could fend for himself,at that age.
ED: That't what I thought on since I been grown. But at the time he toldit it was just a funny tale. But after I got a little older, certainly been a little different, in my mind. It any longer funny. And from, he was at this old maid's for a long time, and by the way she had a team of mules. And, I suppose they found out they could bluff that little boy. And bluff they did. Anyhow, to his dying day he hated mules. Absolutely. He loved a horse. He loved cows. But he certainly had no use for mules. And he almost got us kids convinced of the same thing. My brother has never had mules. But anyhow, when I married my second husbandhe convinced me that mules were all right. They nearly as bad as those little rascals my father tried to work. (Sam interrupts with question)
SAM: He kept working to take care of himself as he grew up and he learnedhow to do that kind of thing? us
ED: .. Yes. He was very good with stock of all kinds.He had learned to doanything. When he went to ask for a job, why, he expected to do what they asked him to do. ...And then he went on to New Mexico here he teld us were the next stories. And of course .here he was there, there was lots of dry ground. Kansas and New Mexico both,why terribly dry it was. But this was an older man took him to work in New Mexico. He learned to truly think alot of him. His first name was Frank, but I can't remember his last name. But anyway, he had grown to be fourteen or fifteen years old by the time he left Frank's. And he had heard of the West, you know, and all of the stories that„come from the West. Bf course, they'd been repeated and exaggerated. So, he wanted to get Wast. And he came to the West all right enough.
SAM: I wonder what he expected; whet those exaggerated stories were telling him.About wild Indians?
ED: Well he never seid anything about the Indians. In fact, he always lovedthe Indians for neighbors.that we had here. But Ithink that he expected more money because that had been his problem, you know, so long, trying to get enough. And he came to Idaho and he came to Moscow first. That's where he landed fir8t. Idon't know where else he had worked. He came to work, and there he ended up with afamily of Kroghs. And he very fond of them. He said they were the nearest parentsAhe'd found along the way. He surely thought elot of them.
They were quite alarge family, but Idon't believe they hadany boys. They had two or three girls. And meybe they had boys, but Ican't remember him speaking of them. But he certainly was fond of that family. And from there, why, he came to Cameron. That's up by Leland. And there he worked for several of the people that Ilaarnsdto know after Iwas grown. He went from there and, Isuppose, it time he worked there heolel around and found the property he finally homesteaded on, where us children were raised.
SAM: Close to Cameron?
ED: No. It's closer to the Clearwater River. And of course, in growinqup we went to school. We had aschooling the Cleerwater River. And ue walked up and down the hills.
SAM: He met your mother riding the area, then?
ED: Right. At Leland. Yes, he met my mother there. At the time she washelping the owner of aresturant in Leland. She was fourteen years old, but they weren't married until she was fifteen, pause
SAM: What do you remember of your childhood growing up on the homesteadthere? What was it like?
ED: Well, it was very good. I mean we had enough to eat and enough clothes.And we had pleasures that were children's at that time. Ican't remember being denied too many things. We walked to school when he was using the horses andhe weather got bad and he couldn't use the horses in the field we elways rode the work horaeto school. And that lasted then till spring work began and then we had to give up our horse and walk to school again. But we always had agift or two at Christmas time, usually clothes. And probably an orange. And Ican remember that one time, the teacher gave us abanana.for Christmas, my sister and I. The other two weren't large enough to go to school yet.That was really a treat.
We played games at that time. Mostly singing games. And quite abit of baseball of course because Ithink that't been auniversal game ever since kids began.
My mother always had to work real hard. She worked in the field, too.We couldn't afford ahired man. So Ilearned to cook and careffor the other chuldren real young. Ithink the summer Iwas eight was the first summerhe let me go ahead with the cooking. Before that Ihad helped her. Iprepared the noon meal while they were in the field. Not every day but lots of days.
SAM: Were you the oldest?
ED: Yes, I was the oldest child. And all of my school work and all of my plans wereto grow up to be a teacher.
SAM: Where do you think that idea first got into your head?
ED: Ihave no idea. The folks said that that was one of the first words/I'd learned to say. Although I didn't say it plainly. I still was going to be a teacher. And how I got it I can't explain because I can't remember. I really don't know.
SAM: Were there many other families also homesteading around yours?
ED: Every hundred and sixty had a family on it. And when I started toschool, we had between forty-eight and fifty in the school. And the school stayed that way for several years and began to dwindle. They got down to the last two or three terms and they only had eight or ten1 And then school busing began.
SAM: What was the name of the school?
ED: It was called Cold Spring school. There were two or three large springsabove it.
SAM: ...If you tried to locate it now, roughly where would it be?
ED: It's still there. That's where my husband and I lived after we weremarried.My second husband. We lived in the school house that we went to school together in. It was called school but it was below, It was right down on the road and the railroad between Lewiston and Orofino. At that time the train went to Stipes and back every day. It came to Stipes and went to Lewiston and came back to Stipes every night.
SAM: This is the same as Cold Springs?
ED: The Cold Springs school was right down close to the river, closeto the railroad track, and, you couldn't call it a highway, but anyway, it was a road between Lewiston and Orofino. But it had no gravel on it at that time. It was paved after I started to normal school.
SAM: Was there much of a neighborhood at that time in that area among thedifferent families? Did they, get, together much? Was there a lot of socializing?
ED: Yes. It was all centered around the school.during the school term.They had parties and programs and they used to have a revival or two the winter and every one went. Everyone who was able to go went. Because that was the only recreation place that they had was the school. During the summer we had a Sunday School organizer. You never heard him called Mr. Johnson, " was "Sunday School" Johnson. It made no difference. Everyone called him that. Here r' two weeks ago a lady said," That's the first time I've heard of "Sunday School" Johnsoiv wa I was showing some pictures and I had his picture. She asked," Whatever happened to him"? and I said," Well,I suppose he died, because that's been many years ago."
SAM: This was one man who organized the Sunday School?
ED: Yes. He went from this school house, to this school house to thisschool house. And each place he went, he organized the Sunday School. Sunday School from the end of school until after school began in the fall. They'd have it a Sunday or two, usually according to the weather, really.
SAM: So it would be something he would offer for one or two weekends andbe on to the next place?
ED: Well,usually he was there just that weekend when he organized it. Hewould come into the school, and you know, they had gathered for Sunday School. He would elect officers and give them books, hand them books, you know, and tell them what to do. I suppose the rules were written, I don't know. But, anyway, he would get them started. And then he'd go onto the next one. And the next spring he would start the rounds again. He usuallystarted along the river, because the weather began early to be good, down lower. Then he went on up into the high country. I often wonder, "Did he walk all that distance"? I can't other remember that he had a team. You know the accessor and thecounty officals all had a one-horse shay. I don't know how he got around. I remember that he had a horse. Maybe he did.
SAM: Did he actually lead the services the day he was there, or did he...
ED: Yes. He took it so we'd know what to do afterwards. Course it wasthe older mothers that took charge. And I had the same Sunday School teacher from the time that I started Sunday School, which was when I must have been about six years old, until I graduated from the eighth grade at the KJL school, the Cold Springs school.
SAM: What did Sunday School amount to? What did you do at Sunday School?
ED: We all had a little paper. This little paper came. I suppose theysent for it. We had a little donation you know, each day, each Sunday. They ordered these papers. And then the teachers would take paperifc and teach the children the story for that day, and teach them the Bible verse. Each Sunday School lesson began with a Bible verse that they memorize. And that's what it was. ah, yes, if we learned the Bible verse, you know, that was the first thing, and then if we could repeat it by the time it was time to be excused, why my teacher anyway, and I suppose the rest of them did too, had little seals that they would put on our Sunday School pamphlet. It had a little flower on it and sometimes a picture of children. It was only about an inch square. But any , it was like our stamp, you know, it was glued on the back. She would just hand each one of us one : learned the verse that day. And that was our prize. I guess you'd call it a prize.
SAM: So then, was there singing and a study lesson as part of it?
ED: Yes, oh yes, always sang several songs.
SAM: Was this the main... were these the same kids that you went to schoolwith?
ED: Yes, they were the same children. So each of us knew all about them.pause
ED: Andme ana my brother, and my sister, and my sister Helen.
SAM: (appears to be looking at ED's photograph collection) Sunday SchoolJohnson looks like a pretty interesting fellow.
ED: He was a wonderful person. I've got some more here. This is the school.Let's see, these are the same. Let's see if 've got some more here. This is the school. Anyway, that's not the first school, that's two or three years later. Here's the first one.You see how many youngsters there are with one teacher? And these are pictures of first women, I mean women in the first community where I taught after I started teaching. I boarded with this lady. And this girl is still living here in Kendrick. We went to school together. And this was her sister. Her little girl went to school to me. They lived there. See, here's the mother. These two girls mother right there, Mrs. Robinson.
SAM: What's her name now this...
ED: This is Sue Craig. She lives here in Kendrick. And this woman'sstill alive. And this one. This was Rose Fairington, and this is her sister,. Gertie orendorf. And this'woman passed away a few years ago. Mrs. Sauders(name unclear to transcriber). And this is Mary Forrest. And this is her mother, Mrs. Forrest. And this one's gone.Mrs. Kimley. And this was Mrs. auder Now, you have Mr.
SAM: Yes, that's his wife.
ED: And I boarded with them for three years when I taught at this school.See there, they're standing this side of the schoolhouse. The schoolhouse is out this way,this is the flagpole and the schoolhouse was way. And I had three little girls and one little boy from her. And I had her little boy. She lives right down here where you turn this way, Mrs. Fairington. She's passed seventy years old now. And I had two boys from her. And I had two of her grandchildren. ..her little girl. And my sister that lived way up on the hill above that was too far for her little boy to go to school, so she sent him up to Grandma'a Grandma just lived down here in the hollow you know/%o the little cousins came to school together.And this one lives in Clarkston, and this one lives in Osburn,Idaho you know, up in that mining country.
SAM: How many children did you have in the first school that you taught at,more or less?
ED: I suppose about fifteen.
SAM: And what was the name of that school?
ED: The Crescent school. The Crescent community. And the Crescent school.And they moved that school out a few years ago and were going to remodel it and they did move it, but they didn't do a thing with it. It is just rotting away. It breaks my heart when I go by. And these are the rocks above school, the Cold Spring school. We got the water from a spring right up in here. Later they changed it and got the water from a spring back up towards there was a family that lived up here where the teacher always boarded. And they had a big spring, so they piped it down into the school. And here are some of the same ladies. My Sunday School teacher is right there. That's Mabel Johnson. And, let's see. We had... here's Grandma Johnston and here she is right there. Now, let's see. I believe it's this woman right here I think is the next one. I know she's there. No, that ..her. Oh, here's Mrs.Collingwood right there. That's Mabel's mother. And there's Mrs.Peak right there. Now, I don't know whether this is a hots springs or not. I can't really tell; But, anyway...
SAM: Can you remember what the revivals were like?
ED: Yes. They were a lot of screaming and jumping, you know. We'd all goto hell for sure if we pay attention and do what he said. And of course we had lots of singing, too, which the children enjoyed. But the revivals were always, I guess you'd say, a headache for most of us. Especially to the children because, oh, they got so wild.
SAM: Were the kids, expected to stay there?
ED: Oh, yes. You bet they were. And then another thing they were expectedto be mighty quiet. You get up and do what the kids do nowadays.
SAM: How long would revivals go on?
ED: Usually about two weeks. Sometimes only one week, but usually two weeks.
SAM: Well that's a long time. This would be a traveling minister? A fellowwho would go from place to place?
ED: Well, I suppose. But he was probably set out to this certain place bya church, you know, like in Lewiston or Spokane or Moscow.
SAM: And your parents would go to these?
ED: Yes. The parents would all go. I had one here of my mother in it but Idon't seem to have it in this group, (referring to pictures that SAM and ED are still looking at).
SAM: Well what was going to school like for you when you were a kid?
ED: I enjoyed it very much. Of course there were so many that the teachercouldn't give all of us, you know, a lot of attention. So we had to work pretty much with ourselves. Sometimes when we were younger we could go to some of the older girls in the seventh and eighth grade, and they would help us. But, anyway, it was always a very pleasant thing for me because I was real good in arithmetic and Spelling. Of course we always had countdowns and spelldowns and so on. And I guess I probably won my share of both. That's what we'd do on Friday afternoon after last recess. We'd either go up to the blackboard and/ichoose someone to come up and beat us at arithmatic, or else the teacher would say, "Well, we're going to have a spelling contest this afternoon". She would choose two leaders. One over there and one over here. And then they would choose their people that they wanted to spell with them. And of course, it was quite acontest. You know, we studied especially for that 'cause we wanted our side to win. And of course it did sometimes,
SAM: Did, was there a literary at your school?
ED: No, not at that school. But we had a literary at Crescent and atCedar Ridge. And we would have it one Saturday night at Cedar Ridge, and one Saturday night at Crescent. That way the two communities would get together, it would be a bigger program, and more fun. So. That's what we had. for fun. After the paper was read and the jokes. were all finished why then, we'd get out and play games in the middle of the floor. Usually singing games and running games, whatever gave us the most exercise.
SAM: The games now, now these weren't dances, right?
ED: Oh no., In earlier days you weren't allowed to dance in the schoolhouse.That was a terrible thing. But, anywayi, as time went on, they did allow them. Well, communities were different, too. There were some communities that did allow dancing, but then, I never happened to be in one of those. At Cold Spring school that wouldn't have gone over very big there, either. But anyway we had our little games that we played.
SAM: Can you remember what any of these happen to be? Because, these gamesseem like
(End of side A)
almost a lost art
ED: Well, I'm almost not able to sing them any more. That's the worst part,Ijust can't remember them. I can't remember the little songs that went with them. I sang part of one, 'The Miller Boy' the other day, but you know, I didn't have near all of it there. It's just left roe. It's been too far, too long ago. There is one that maybe I could sing.(pause.) I can't remember how it starts. (Tune she sings is children's song known as 'Go in and out the Window)
Song: I measure my love to show you.I measure my love to show you I measure my love to show you For we have gained the day. And then we took our hands and put them out this way. " I measure my love to show you". Now, then. Song:(continues) Go forth and choose your lover Go forth and choose your lover Go forth and choose your lover For we have gained the day.
SAM: Nice words!
ED: Yes. Oh, yes. Kids just thought that was wonderful. And especially whenthey got up into the seventh and eighth grade why, they thought that was more fun.
SAM: What did they do, what', was the game that would go with this singing?
ED: Well, they formed a circle you know, you ran and got your partner andthen you all got in a circle. There were always the extras in the center. They would be the ones,, n 'do what the song said. But they would get, when they- chose their partner, they would get their partner out of the ring and bring it into the center. And then, whatever the song said, those actions they would go through. Let's see. What were some of the others?
SAM: What was 'The Miller Boy' one that you were singing to me before?Do you remember?
ED: Well, I don't know any more of that than Isang such a little of itthen.
SAM: I'm trying to think of even what you sang.
SAM: Is it 'Happy is...
ED: Song: Happy is the miller boy that lives by the millThe mill turns around with its own free will Hand in the hopper and the other in the sack The gents all forwards and the ladies fall back And of course you can reverse it then. You can say'The ladies go forward'. Well then, whoever goes forward is in the center. If its the ladies, the center is full of ladies and the men are going around the outside. And then, let's see, how did we get out of there? (pause) . ... that awful?
SAM: No, it - Its been a long time
ED: I can't get them out of there to save me. (pause while she goes throughsong to herself). No sir, I can't get them.
SAM: It matter at all.
ED: I know it, but its just gone, that's all. I wish my sister was here.Maybe she could think of them.
SAM: Tell me about what,, parties were like, though. Were they really festiveoccassions? Did the kids really...
ED: Oh, the kids were just- well there was nothing like it. They just wereso tickled to go and be a part of the fun. And of course, each mother a cake or either took sandwiches orAcookies, and usually the coffee was on the house, and cocoa, (phone rings) Hm. Somethings wrong. Mine is two shorts and that was two longs, (referring to phone rings). And of course this is the occassion where the young people would seemingly choose the ones you know, that were their real friends.When their mothers would get the lunches fixed up you know,, why the little boys, or big boys by that time, would go and "choose a girl. And that's the way they kind of got started, (phone rings). (She continues to speak, and it is garbled in the ringing.) But, it was the begining of...(phone continues to ring).
SAM: Was the whole family (noise of squeaking and chair and phone ringingdeletes first part of question) It wasn't just the kids?
ED: Oh, no. Everyone was there. The whole family, (phone continues to ring).(She explains why she isn't answering the phone).
SAM: So you said before... First let me ask you, how long would the partiesgo on? Would they go on till late at night or what?
ED: Usually till ten or ten-thirty. No later than that. The dances used togo until midnight. And in the winter time sometimes they liked them much longer than that. You'd hear of them going home at three and four o'clock. But, anyway, at the schools, well, I guess they were more thoughtful. I don't know what else you'd say. They'd quit playing ten and then most people would be home by ten-thirty or eleven.
SAM: Everybody sang the song who was playing in the game?
ED: Yeah. Everyone sang.
SAM: It sounds like it wasn't too far from being a dance.
ED: Well, the song you know, really made the music and they skipped around.But, anyhow, there was no... you paired off in couples in several of the plays, you know, but then, you changed more often than you did in a dance. Of course, they weren't held the same way, either as they were in a dance. But, anyway,, it was all fun. Just truly,fun.
I know another one we used to play that some of the ladies thoughtwas too rough and that was 'Flying Dutchman'. There was no song to that. You chose your partner. Then you got in the ring. But you held hands. You all held hands. And then, there was an "IT". And the "IT" would for the first thing, you seego around and he'd hit between two hands. This may not have been the original partner, you know. Cause, you took hold of hands and you're standing beside the other partner. But anyhow, that's why they held hands, so that they could choose, you know, you might get two boysy,that way, and, oh dear, I'll tell}you, that was a race. The "IT" you see, went one way, and the couple that he hit went the other way. And when they met over here, sometimes it was a hard bump. And then the one that got back to that place, that one got to stay. But "IT" was outside again. And so, if it was the one that was "IT" before, fine. He got beat, or that couple. But anyway, . . they had to hit somebodythat they could beat, you see, in order to get back in the circle again. There were so many of them that we used to play, but they're all gone from my head now.
SAM: Did the older people play in these games?
ED: Yes, lot's of times they did. Especially the young married couples.Grandma and Grandpa didn't get up andplay. But then, they used to sit on the sides, and if they weren't visiting right then, why they'd sing along with the kids that were singing and help out with the noise.
SAM: Do you think this was the main chance for visiting that theneighborhood had?
ED: Yes. That would be one of the real chances they had to visit.Of course, they used to have dinner, and maybe the Jones would ask the Smith's over. Or maybe the Smith's would go over to the Johnson's for dinner. But, anyway, the, that was their particular visiting. You know, maybe friends. There at the school, when you had something there, everybody got to visit. It was a big thing.
SAM: How much of this depended on a teacher? Was the teacher supposedto organize this at all, or was this something...
ED: Yes, this was, the teacher was head of it all. She, whatever wasmaybe this was the program, why then, of course, she sent home cute little invitations, you know, that the children made to mom and dad. Everyone, well, no one could refuse their kids, you know, they had to be there. And then, of course if it was a revival meeting, there were no games. You just went and sat, and listened to the speaker, and went home. And the teacher had nothing to do with that. All she did was swept the floor usually. And then of course for the literaries like where we used to have them at Crescent, and Cedar Ridge, lots of schools had those all around, over by Moscow and potlatch, wherever you went you'd hear about the literary funthey/had Friday night or Saturday night, whichever night they'd had them on. So that was several different works, because the young people would hear a joke, and either put it on a slip of paper and send it to school, or else,come up to school and give it to you. The teacher would write them down. And then they had what they called a "literary reader" and that person would then, whenever the literary got toether, then they would read that. They called it a literary paper. That was the news in it. All these jokes. And about the funniest one, now you've seen Sue's picture, we had a teacher at Cedar Ridge who's name was Miz Leach(sp). Course, I'd gone to school with her, I knew her real well. But she was a card, I'll tell you. That gal, she always had fun, I don't care where she went, she had fun. And so we had a coasting party one night. There were several of the older men that cemetnat were, our chaperones, but then, we didn't call them that. They kept the fire. The boys, each one had these great, long sleds about yea long,. They'd holler,"So-and-so, get on behind me! So-and-so, get on behind her!" And this particular time, Miz Leach was the last one on there. She only had about that much to sit on. And of course, just as soon as that sled started, you know, why, it hit something and she fell off. But she followed the sled down the hill. Now this... shut this off (referring to the tape recorder)
SAM: Oh, is it going to be that bad?
ED: She went...
SAM: Why don't you try to tell it in a way that we can put it down.
ED: Alright after. Let me start it again.
ED: ...coasting party and so the ones that were sitting out, you know,this trip down, Zimmerman had brought, had rode a horse, had ridden a horse, and/ytook off his spurs of course, to go down the hill, to coast. And he left them laying right by the fire. And this Sue Robinson, then, came along and she was going to sit down. Well, the firelight against the spurs had caused the snow to melt right there and she thought, "Well, it wouldn't be so wet to sit there." So she started to sit down. And that old Gus Fairington said," I seen lots of people act on the spur of thei moment. But,I never saw anybody sit on a spur for a moment. (She laughs).
SAM: Well, these coasting parties, some people would bring along toboggansand everybody would...
ED: No. Just the young boys would bring their toboggans. They were sleds,very if there And none of them were boughten. That is,jfew of therruwere boughten ones. You know, people couldn't afford them, then. But anyway, the boys would holler the names of the ones to get on behind them. You know, they'd be the front ones. They'd be the ones to put their feet in the things to guide them. And they'd holler, "So-and-so get behind so-and-so.", and away they'd go. And, oh, it was a long hill. It went just like this. But the snowplow had ploughed out the snow. You know, sometimes it'd be that high. And they couldn't get over. But anyway. That coasting hill sure was something. It's i still there, too.
SAM: Well, afterwards, would people get inside and have a hot drink?
ED: No. They'd coast for an hour or two, and then everybody'd go home.Like I say, there'd ' be three or four older men, that had girls or boys there, that would go and keep the fire, and see that the kids kept straight and good. Nobody thought of doing anything different, really. Because nobody said a word, you know, about a chaperone. But anyhow, these older people present kept things all right.
SAM: Well these papers that you talk about now, where they full aboutgossip about people too?
ED: Just jokes.
SAM: Were they personal? Were they about particular people?
ED: Yes. We had the one about ue sitting on the spur in the nextpaper. But anyway there was always something. Just everybody. They'd see something in the paper. You know,a a newspaper or used to be jokes at the bottom of magazines, you know, They'd have a story and then there'd be a little space left and they'd put a story in there. Well, instead ofnames that were in the book, they'd putAnames that were in the community. And so we had a joke on So-and so that way.
SAM: Well, if someone did something at all funny, could they expectto find it in the newspaper?
ED: Yeah, they expected to find it in the paper. And, especially ifyou went out with a new boyfriend, why, you bet your name was in the next paper.
SAM: Would one person read the whole paper?
ED: Yes. The literary reader would read that. Oh, there were only twoor three sheets each time.
SAM: Did this change around from time to time who would read it?
ED: Yes. Because at the begining of each school year, when theydecided to organize literary, why then, they had to choose the literary reader, and they had to choose, oh, what did they call the ones wrote the jokes? Well, anyhow, whatever it was, I suppose the editor, and that was usually the teacher, they'd bring them all to her, and she'd write 'em up for 'em. I know I wrote 'em all the time at Crescent.
SAM: Well now, is that it for the literary program, or was there morethan just the reading of the paper?
ED: No. They read the newspaper andjsometimes they had a program.The young people would have a program. Or sometimes just one family, you know, if they were musical, would get out and play several songs and maybe the whole group would sing songs. Let's see, what else did they do? Anyhow, there was another chance to eat. The mothers always brought the cakes and sandwiches.
SAM: Would playparty games follow after the literary?
ED: Yes, usually. But like I say, Mr. and Mrs. Kent are still living.They live right here the top of American Ridge, the first house. And family was very musical. They'd get out and start to sing and everybody would sing..Maybe they wouldn't play any games that time. And there wouldn't be anybody so musical there, and they'd get out and play the running games. So it just depended on how things shaped up (pause). I really and truly enjoyed my teaching years. It, and so many of those children are around, you know, in the different communities since I have not moved away from, very far from home. Why, my pupils and the boys... men and women that I went to school with, and neighbors children, maybe that I didn't go to school with, are still around. I see them at every meeting that I attend of kind. Whether I go to Kendrick, or whether I go to Deary or Southwick, or wherever, I see some of my pupils and some of my former school mates.
SAM: Well, when you started helping around the house, as you weresaying, just as a little kid, did you take much of your day doing that when you came home from shhool? Did you have work chores to do?
ED: Oh, yes. I always had chores to do. My sister's job, when wegot home from school, was always to shuck the corn for the cows and pigs. And I always put the stuff in the barn and fed them hay. And then there were pigs to feed, and I suppose one of the other kids had to do that. I can't remember doing that very much, except in the summertime. When the folks had to work they me, " You go ahead and feed the pigs now." And then, I learned to milk at a Very early age, too. I must not have been any more than six or seven..
SAM: Did you have much time to play?
ED: Yes. I guess I had as much time as the other children in thecommunity had to play, because, we all had about the same thing to do. Some of thern howled more about having to do the chores and how many they had to do, than I ever did, because I enjoyed it. I got out of washingdishes that way sometimes.
SAM: uid you have something else to do?
ED: Yes. ittlot rather milk the cow than do the dishes than I thoughtI would. And then, we always had calves that we had to put into the pasture, and then go get and put in the barn. And my children did that when they were growing up. I've got so many pictures of my children with j calves. And then, we had little twin calves one time. They all had to have pictures with them. Of course, after we got older, I mean, you can put the cows and horses in the barn when you:'re seven or eight, but then, when we got up to nine or ten, why then, we used to have to help in the garden, and help dad when he planted potatoes or planted corn, or something. There was always something to do. But there a was always a few minutes after lunch, or maybe after supper, sometime, when we had a chance to run , play, do the things we wanted to.
SAM: Well, for you to become a teacher, what did you need to do, whatdid you do?
ED: Well, I graduated from the eighth grade at and then, I wenttwo years to high school at Leland, and then we had a neighbor, Mr. McFadden that got me a job in Orofino. I got a job with the superintendent of schools to help his wife and especially to babysit, because you know, the superintendent has so many obligations he and his wife, and so they wanted a dependable person to take care of their children. They had two little girls. So, anyhow, that was my first job, to go and stay with this couple and go to school. So I passed the eleventh grade in Orofino. And then, the next year, the same man, Mr. McFadden, got me a job the banker's home in Lewiston. And it was the same thing over again. The banker and his wife had so many social obligations, they wanted somebody to take care of their two little boys. And of course, Mr. McFadden told them what a good girl I was, so the Mackys' took me to stay for the school year. But Mrs. Macky was lots harder to work for. And, in February I took a cold. And ycould not get over it, because she expected me to get up and go down and wash the dishes, and look after the furnace fire, and all those thingsAyou're not supposed to do when you have a cold. And I guess, I got pretty sick because, she got scared and sent for my mom. So mom took me away from there. And I stayed then with Weingardners. They had been our neighbors many years before, and had moved to Lewiston, to retire. So, Mrs. Weingardner said she'd keep me until school was out. Of course, I was graduating, and I had lots more schoolwork to do, you know, then I did in the years before. So, that's what I did for my room and board.
SAM: How much work were you expected to do for your room and board?You just said briefly what you had to do, it sounds like quite a bit.
ED: Well, it was a lot in Lewiston. But in Orofino, at the superintendent'shouse, I had a real nice place to stay. I was expected to get up and get breakfast, and usually to wash the dishes. If there wasn't time to wash the dishes, why, I went on to school. Mrs. would do them. And then , in the evening when I came home, I was to help get the evening meal. And then I washed the dishes. And on Saturday and Sunday, 15 expted to help with all the meals, maybe, get breakfast alone. And then, the house had to be cleaned. There was always scrubbing to do, and vacuming to do, beds to change, and so on. I did those things. But anyhow, when I went to Lewiston, that was really something.
SAM: What extra was there that she was expecting you to do besides...
ED: Well, they had so many dinner parties, you know, and I had neverbeen used to that, and, of course, I had to serve. This was really, what would you say, a classical home? And I was the same as a servant when it came to serving the meal. It was just about the same when the meal was to get ready.(phcne rings) She expected me to do a lot of things that I had never done before.(phone rings again)
SAM: All this while you were in school.
ED: Yes, and I had a heavy load. Well, I stayed up and did my workbecause I was bound to get through. I wanted to graduate, and I did. And then that summer, I stayed with the County superintendent. Her folks and my folks had been neighbors when they were young people. And then when she got to be County superintendent she was stilly friend' of the family. And so, when I graduated from high school, you see, I was in Lewiston, and I had seen her from time to time, and when she found out I was graduating and that I wanted to go to Normal that summer, she said, "Why don't you come stay with me?" And she says,"After you get to teaching, you can pay me back for your board." So that's what I did. She charged me fifty dollars board for the summer, nine weeks. Can you Imagine that? What would you think now a days? Anyway, I stayed with her. She was a cripple. I stayed with her three summers, I think. See, when I went toAschool that first summer, all I got was what they called a "third grade certificate". You could only teach one year on that. Well, then the next summer, I got in two quarters. My school was only a seven months school. So, I was a week or two weeks late to go to Normal, but I still took the work and made it up. And I went the spring quarter and the summer quarter. So then, I got a first grade certificate. I could teach three years on that,without going back to school. I was anxious to graduateso l wanted to go every summer. The next summer then, the third summer, they had changed the law that you couldn't teach any more on...
(End of side B)
so I could go back and finish Normal.
SAM: So you went out teaching after that very first summer?
ED: Yes, I was nineteen.
SAM: Mnd was that when, was Crescent the first school you taught at?
ED: Yes. I taught there three years.
SAM: How did you happen to find the place near that?
ED: Well, always, in each community there's a home that teachers havelived at, you know, Of course, when something happens, like a death or something, why of course you don't go there any more. But anyhow, they had been boarding the teacher. And it's the second one in the Cold Spring school, the family that boarded the V teacher livedjup the road a little ways above the school house. They always, the first school, when I went to first grade, I can remember that the teacher used to go up the hill to Hoskins. So, you know, when you go into the community, or usually, the clerk the school board would tell you, "Your're supposed to board So-and-so." Jo that's what we did.
SAM: You were saying to me that the were really nice people to live with?
ED: They were wonderful. In fact, everyone in the uhold community waswonderful as far as I was concerned.
SAM: Tell me what it was; that made their place especially nice.
ED: They both were just so kind to me. And Mrs. Wriwas justlike a mother to me. hen I would go out in the evening, you know, to a dance or something, she'd say, you be home at eleven o'clock." She couldn't say Eva, she was Russian. Or if it was something else, "You be home at a certain time." She specified that. I suppose a lot of people would have rebelled against that, I don't know. I've heard of girls that did. They don't even mind mother and father. But I did'nt mind. Mr. Bd- was always doing something so nice. I know one time a family that their children rode to school on a little pony. They qame to school one morning and said,"We've got a baby sister." Well, right away, I wanted to see that little baby sister. So I'said something about it when we were esting, at fcaMtols one night.
And he said,"Well, wait til Saturday and you caniRowdy over."That's the first one of their horses that I ever rode. I rode Rowdy over and saw the new baby. The whole community . so, I don't know how you'd say it, they were just the friendliest people that could ever be. That Mrs. Kimbly that you saw in the picture there, now her three daughters, still when I see them, theylre just as dear to me as a sister would be, or a younger sister. And the oldest girl cooks now at Moscow, and she comes down every once in a while 4 she z the day off. that's Margaret Craig. There are two of her brothers that live here. One lives in Kendrick, but the other lives out of Kendrick always. And when they see me they come and shake hands and ask me this and that, and "Have you still got your cows? Do you have chickens, too?" They're still interested in me. And I know one time when.the older boy was in school, that the County superintendent came to visit one day, which was her duty. That was Lloyd Kimbly. He came up and read to me. His story was about a little blue bird.
That was his first year in school. I showed him what to study forafter lunch. They read twice a day when they were little like that, so they'd get good.They got a dozen little books for them to get through. When he got back to his seat, why, the superintendent stepped up to him, and she said,"Would you draw me a picture?" Yes, he was very anxious to draw a picture for So she wrote on his tablet, on the top line or two, draw a bluebird. Color the bird blue. He she thought did that. Mnd I suppose that maybe, he know how to do this. But, anyway,he did it . He drew her a bluebird. He colored it blue, and then he took it to her. She was sitting in the back. If some thing just right, she'd write it down so she could tell ma later, she say anything then. And my, he proud when she smiled and said, What a wonderful bluebird that is." well, you know, you could have given him a dollar, he have been any happier. And now, he's a great big young man, my goodness He's got a family.
SAM: You know, when you were first starting there, and you were onlynineteen, were you very apprehensive about it,did you find it difficult at first, or was it easy?
ED: It was easy. The only thing.I ever worried about was discipline.If I disciplined I always wondered had I done the right thing. I don't know. I never had any trouble that way. I did a year or two later.My second school was the Linden school, and I had four or five large boys. There was one that was known in the community to be a pretty bad boy. He went on that way for, still is, I guess. He » changed. He never did learn to work. He was the leader, in other words, and he got these other young boys in the eighth grade, they have been some seventh grade boys in it too. But anyway, I can't remember exactly what they did any more, but they sure raised a rumpus in school. And so I expelled a couple of them. And one boy ran away. The other boy So, of course, when evening came, the news was all ready out. It had gone home, all right enough. And when school was out that evening, the boy who'd run away, mother erne to the schoolhouse. hey'd heard that I had expelled her boy and the bad boy. I . have expelled the Wadmark boy. But then, I thought he was as deep as the other one in it. But he „„ And anyway, he was so afraid of being punished at home, that's why he ran away. But the other one did. Anyhow, t his Porter boy saw Mrs.Wadmark coming up the road, and he went down to meet her. And he said,"Mrs. Wardmark, I'm so sorry. It was all my fault. William have been expelled and I'm so sorry, it was all my faulty" Well everybody thought he was being a good boy then. They felt sorry for him too. But actually it was the Wadmark boy that should have felt sorry, because it his fault, this other kid had done him in for it. So, that was quite a hurtful thing, for me. Especially, after I talked to Mrs. Wadmark, because... And later, now that I'm older, you know, Mr. Wadmark was so cruel to his horses. If he whipped kids like he whipped those horses and treated them, I don't wonder at that poor William running away. But you know, a young person, you learned all those things yet.
SAM: What was her attitude when she spoke to you about it?
ED: Well, she wanted to knou why and I told her. And she said ,"Well,why you have told me first before?" I said.I was angry of course at the things that they had done. And I said there were some other boys were getting into it too, and I thought that I would break it up. Well, she said,"I don't know why you picked on my poor boy." I said,"I pick on him, I just figured that he was in the wrong." The laws then were a little different than they are now. They went home for three days and then the mother, or father, or both could bring him back to school and have him apologizes, and also, they were expected to go to the school board and apologize. Then they,could come back to school. I don't think its that way now.A I'm not acquainted with their rules ... I don't suppose the be away from school or that he be punished always. Of course, we don't know what his father would have done, because like I say, years later I felt entirely different about it.
SAM: Did he come back?
ED: No. He went to an uncle at Deary.and stayed there. I don't know'he ever came back home or not. Ican't remember.
SAM: You felt badly about it even at the time, because you felt thiskid really so guilty.
ED: No, he nearly i'guilty as the other one. I had trouble withthat other one all my life. I rented a house in Bovill to him. I never did get any money from him. So I wrote him a letter and told him that the sheriff would evict him in a day ortwo. The sheriff did evict him. George wrote me a letter "was just ready to bring you a check. I don't know what you did that for." That was another one of his schemes.
SAM: What had he done at school?
ED: I can't remember all of it but anyhou, they had taken their pens.I don't know whether you knew or not, but the old seats, the board went just down here a little ways, and they took the sharpened end of their pencils and they poked the girls.The girls came up, and there were two or three of them that made a scream. George had several of them fixed up so they were doing they should nt do.
SAM: I take it it was probably more than one thing, too.
ED: It probably was. Those things always built up. They do somethingtoday and we'll do something bigger tomorrow. When they're into mischief.
SAM: When you had to discipline kids, what usually would you do?
ED: I usually spanked them. The little ones I usually made stand in acorner. Sometimes I made them stay in at recess. Sometimes the bigger ones had to stay if they have their lessons-done. They had to stay untill they...The ones that were big enough to understand what they were spanked for, were spanked. The last years that I taught,you touch them. You still can't.
SAM: Did you find in your early years of teaching you needed to spankkids very often?
ED: Not very often.Most of the time I made them stand in thecorner or stay in, recess. That was the first thing. Some of them, you never had to do anything more to. Its just one of those things think its the same with children today, that a lot of them you don't have to punish so much. You're not allowed to any more. And that a person needs. And a child needs to know that they can be punished too. That helps their behavior quite a bit.
SAM: What did you find enjoyable about teaching in those early years'?.
ED: I think it was the accomplishment and seeing them learn. Most ofthem, real fast. They seemed to enjoy it. and I certainly enjoyed teaching them. I thououghly loved to teach the little kids. And I finally got to do that the last four yearsI taught. When they consolidated the schools, you see, I was teaching in a country school, andthey took me to town. I went to Orofino one year, and then I was at Deary three years. And all I had was just little first graders. That was the most enjoyable experience that I just ever had. I loved to teach the others, but those little ones you can just, well of course, you've got all the time for them, when you just have the one grade. It was kind of complicated in Orofino, 'cause I had thirty-one. I still spent all my time just giving it to them.They sure can absorb a lot of it. Its so wonderful to see them. Andthe rate of learning that they can do, You just believe it unless you were there for a day or two or three.
SAM: Is it because they never had an opportunity to learn in that way?
ED: Yes. They're just all ready to swallow it. Those that are able tolearn fast, I don't know how much more, if you could , if you had more time, how much more you could teach them in days that you have to do it. But it certainly is fun.
SAM: it hard to prepare all those different lessons for all thosedifferent grades?
ED: when they changed the books, you know, after you'vetaught the same books for a few years, whyits all there. But if they changed the books, you know,like they used to change the health books this year and the arithmatic books next year and the history books the next year, so you always had a new one that you had to study in.But after you taught in certain of these books, you have to do very much. Sometimes you made out a set of questions or something if you were going to have an exam that day, but other than that, that so hard. In the bigger schools, whenever an eighth grade girl or an eighth grade boy, if you've got one that likes to,take?f the little ones and let them read( she is receiving static off a citizen's band radio that she has in the room where the interview is taking place). The older boys and girls, I've had several boyshelping with the younger ones, let them help with the children up to the third or fourth grade. It takes a big load off of the teacher, I had two girls there at Linden that were just as good as any teacher I ever hadhelp me. They were good. They were both eighth grade girls, and they kind of had something going between them," I'll I get my lesson first." And, "I'll get to teach So-and-so." All of us, I don't care who we are, we have a preference; who we want to do what with or who for. And they were that way. How hard they would work to come up to Miss Slatter,"Can I teach the second grade for a little while or is there something I can do for a little while?" They were so sweet and so good. And the little kids loved them too, because they could hejlp them. Of course, if these bigger ones would help, they'd get through with their readers so much quicker, and they'd get a new reader. And of course, that's always such a, well there's just no way to describe it when I get a new reader. There must be seven or eight little first grade books, and we always took the first half of those, and/when they read those, then you let them have the second half of it. So when they got a new book, that was just out of this world. And of course, they loved for these girls to help them because they were so good.: They were like big sisters to the rest of them. But when I was at rescent, there was one of the boys, he's mechanic for the buses for Juliaetta and Kendricknow,I get to see him quite often. He was real good at helping. Of course at Crescent I have so many. I only had thirteen or fourteen. This boy was really good.
What did you do with the kids who were slow learners?
I had very few of them in the country, at Crescent or at Lindenor at Deary or at Park. And at Wilker, I had very few slow learners. I had about the same number in all of them except Linden. I had a big school at Linden, forty-seven or forty-eight. When I went to Orofino that year, the other teachers, you know, you had teachers meetings.in the evening sometimes. Anyhow, they're scheduled. They say'first grade teachers will meet in So-and-so's room at a certain time,'. And the ladies told me what to do, I had never been in a city school like that before. They divide first grade into about five groups. They recommend three groups. But anyhow, the other teachers had more than three, and I had either four or five, and I believe it was five. And they put the very best, that's the first, and then the second best, and third best,down to the worst of course. You don't call them these things, you know. Mine were'birds'. I had red birds and blue birds and black birds, and little canaries and I don't know what all. So they don't know that they're being different the others. You just have to spend twice to three times as much time with the lowest group. There's never anything said. I've often wondered, I had one little girl in the second group, she was just as cute as a button, after about the second week, which is when we divided them, and had them, and kind of got acquainted with them, and you don't put a child in the lower group just because he's bashful. That's why you get acquainted with them first. But anyhow, when we'd divided the classes, and we'd put;.them in rows ,„ you know, because a lot of the work you do right at their desk. Anyhow, this one little girl went horns and told her mother,"I'm in the dumb group." You know, I often wished I knew LO .. because it u the dumb group, it was only the second group. But anyhow, along towards Christmas, or maybe a little later, she got back in the first group. And I'll tell you right now, I guess she was mighty happy. Anyhow, her morn was. But I've wondered about that. How in the world did she know? I think they're smarter than we think.
SAM: I can see where some kids must be aware enough, because they . rankeach other.
ED: I think they must. I had a little Indian boy there that was thecutest thing. He never said a word. You . get him to say a word. Well, he was in the lowest group, of course. But it was just from bashfulness. It went along til Thanksgiving time and he still said a word. So one day, one little boy was reading, and he got stumped. And then everybody would hold up their hands and then I'd nod and somebody would say the word and the reader would go on. And one day, this little Indian boy held up his hand. He had a smile from here to here. ,never saw anything so cute. I nodded to him and he said it. And you know, after that ne Just sit still, he was so happy with himself. It was the cutest thing. And do you know, from then on, he knew all of those words. He .been sitting there doing nothing. He knew just as much to read, maybe not as much as the best ones, but he was real good. I was so surprised. That was one time when I really got a surprise. But I was sure proud of him. He was the cutest little fellow.
SAM: Did you find it was hard not to favor certain kids over others?
ED: That's awfully hard to do. We all have preferences, I think, inour lives. That is a tough one.I loved them all, but I know I told you I had the big boy that helpd so much at Crescent when I first taught there. I sure did think a lot of that boy. I don't know whether I showed it or not. I tried not to. He was just a good boy in every way. There was just no wayyou could have ever found fault with him. He's the same way yet. His mother-in law and father-in-law live here in town. (Tape skips at this point)
SAM: The Crescent? Is that while you were teaching?
ED: Yes. I stayed at his sister's house. That's where I boarded. He wasthe oldest boy, and I boarded with his sister,Edith Smith. We started going together. He had lots of girlfriends, all the time. Before that, I had met him when I taught at Crescent. He was over there with somebody else. He'd bring a girl and go. I'd met him, but anyhow, when I went there to her home to board, why, we started going together and at the end of the school year,we were married. I taught three years at Crescent and then the one year at Linden. And then I already had the contract sighed to teach a year at Wilker, but I only half a year. Because I was pregnant.
SAM: here were you married?
ED: We were married in Asotin. And then we went to live at Park, andwe lived there the whole twenty-two years that he was alive. He died with cancer.
SAM: Did you stop teaching, then, and raise a family?
ED: Yes. The youngest boy was six years old when that teacher shortagestruck in'45. And the at Park came and asked me if my certificate would allow me to teach. And I said yes, I'd graduated. Just a year or two after that, maybe before that, they had a new ruling at the Normal that you had to renew your certificate every five years, but a life certificate, you need to. And I had a life certificate. You see, I had graduated in '31. And of course, they make that new ruling about going back every fifth year, that would have been impossible for me because of my family. So anyhow, I had a life certificate and they came and said they could not find a teacher. So I taught at the Park school and was six years old then.
SAM: Did you find that the... were you sorry to have to give up teachingwhen you got married? Did you find that difficult decision?
ED: Well,I think that was something I accepted, because, in mycondition I go on and teach any longer, so it was just one of the things that I had to do. But I was real happy to go to teaching again when they asked me.
SAM: When was it that you moved to Park ?
ED: Just after we were married. We were married in '31. We went toan old logging camp, and tore down the buildings to get lumber for our own building on the place that he bought. And that's what we did that summer after we were married. We were married in June in 1931. So duringJuly and August we tore these mill buildings down. There'd been a sawmill there. We tore those down to get lumber for our house and barn.
(Tape goes blank at this point)
(End of side C)
ED: There's a doctor here in endrick, and of course the Smith familyacquainted with this doctor, because he'd have to come when some one was ill and their mother had been ill a lot. She passed away when Ben was twelve years old. And when their little brother was born, why, she passed away. Of course they had had the doctor many times. Ben liked him and had talked to him. He very old but anyway, It seems Dr. Hoyt had told him that he'd put his money in.land at Park. So, after we decided to marry, he went to Spokane and made a deal with Dr. Hoyt to have four forties of that land that Dr. Hoyt had put his money in to. So, we had a place. And then, like I say, we went and tore down these buildings for lumber, and then, after that, he got r. to come and help build the house. Ben figured he could build the barn, but he wanted the house a little better. And the house still stands. My oldest son lives there. I tell you, it much of a houso that first winter. the cat out between the cracks for a while. And we had 32-below. No, it was the next winter we hadthirty-two below. We got it fixed up a little better by that time. But it have any extra lumber on it lt was just built, and the boards nailed on, that's all you could say. But anyhow, the next winter, our little girl was getting big enough you know,to crawl. I wondered sometimes if she was going to be warm enough. Her little fingers would just be blue sometimes when I'd look at her. But we fifwiiy got through it and finally got it fixed up better.
SAM: It was log?
ED: No. It was lumber. The barn part log. It was a home. And fromthen on we were trying to clear land. Boy, that was a job.
SAM: How much land was cleared on the place when you moved there?
ED: There was none. It was still not fenced. It was just like timberland. It had been logged quite a while before. And after, oh, it must have beenifive or six years before Ben passed away, he logged it again.
SAM: Is that what he did mostly himself?
ED: Yes. As soon as he got the house and barn put up so we could stayinside, whether 'I finished or not, he went off to the logging camps and I took care of things. And the worst thing that I had to do was haul water. I have nightmares yet about that. We had four barrels on a wagon, and two kegs laid In the front, ten gallon kegs. They were wooden, tool And I had to go and pump those full of water. There was a place they called the'Goldstrom place'. It was the only water in Park. And we had a few cattle, and we had horses. And of course for house use too. He was gone all the time. For many years, anyway. When my boys got big enough to drive horses, they u let'Momma' haul water any more.
SAM: What was there about it that was so unpleasant? Was it dangerous?
ED: No. It was such hard work. You see, you had to pump those fourbarrels full of water, take long to fill the kegs. And you had to get the horses and the wagon ready beforyou went. The worst part was that I had to leave the kids at the house, and I always, you know, before I got to the top of the hill, I always looked to see if the house was on fire. It was a terrible experience.
SAM: How long would the trip take you to get water?
ED: I suppose a couple of hours.
SAM: I've known it to be the case for the wife to be left along whilethe husband was out logging.
ED: Yes. was one of those things when you lived up there in themountains, why he was supposed to go and work a logging camp.
SAM: Yet, mostly, it was the men I've talked to and not the wives,up in the camps, it sounds like it would be pretty rough for the women left at home.
ED: It's terrible. Especially when the children are small. When theyget a little bigger, then it is'nt so bad. The amount of work that there is, there's hogs to feed, and cows to feed and milk, and the horses to take care of. Of course, I only kept up one team most of the time,jjthat I could use to haul water. The rest stayed in the pasture. And then, sometimes, one of them gets lame orjsomething, you have to go get another one. It all takes time. I had a garden . and canning to do. And I can remember many times up and keep the fire going, and the canner boiling til it was about two o'clock in the morning. t takes a while to snap enough beans. My canner held seven quarts. And then get the beans cooked. They had to be cooked four hours. I was always glad when I canned fruit, 'cause that went quicker. It all paid off. My kids are all healthy, and happy, I hope, 'hey're sure good to me.
SAM: How often would your husband get to come home?
ED: He came home Saturday night and he stayed til Sunday night.
SAM: Did you get to see neighbors much when he was away?
ED: Only if they came to visit. Several of them make it a point to comearound and see if we were okay. Especially Mr. Swanseru was the one you had on the tape?
ED: Ed. Ed's son, Adolph. Mr. and Mrs. Swensen were wonderful. Theybe better neighbors. They used to come by and stop and see h we were. Maybe they'd bring a fresh piece of venison. One time they brought a piece of bear meat. That was the first piece of bear meat that I had ever eaten, and I heard so many things. I put it in the oven and roasted it, and fixed it like I usually did a roast, and ' -44 was the best meat I ever ate. I don't know if it was 'cause I was so hungry, or it really was that good. I never will forget that. But they were just real good parents,uh, neighbors.
SAM: Park has always seemed to me to be a very isolated place. Andon top of that, I think how you were teaching all those kids. Then you were raising a family of your own, it sounds like quite a change.
ED: Yes, it really was. Course, I mind raising my family, thatbother so, but, that hauling water, all the women did. I tell you right now, if people could have been up there where they could have looked down on us, I bet they'd have thought that was a sorry mess. Mrs. Austin was a real small woman. They have any sideboards on their wagon. Ben put sideboards on my wagon. I never even thought about it until I saw herbarrels on her wagon with no sideboards. Some mornings I'd get up at three o'clock in the morning so I could get to the well first, so I could enough water for the cows.Sometimes I'd get up at four o'clock and I'd go over there, and there'd be Mrs. Austin. She'd have the thing pumped dry.
And there on up a little higher where you had to dip the water. Thatwas something. And my horses were afraid of the train. Down where we lived there any train. But when you got up to this other place, the train went by in front of where I had to back in, and then step up on the back of the wagon and pour it in the barrels. And I always imagined ' horses were going to start just at the time I got up there , and that would throw a person back, you'd have no way of stopping them. And you'd spill what- -water you already had dipped. Then, Mrs. Inger, they live in Deary, now. And Mrs. Austin is gone. Well, Mr. Austin went first, then, Mrs. Austin. I got to see their oldest son last summer. I'll tell you I knew himwhen I saw him coming. He was down at the hospital down at Lewiston. He came walking across and I couldn't believe my own eyes. He looked just exactly like his dad. I hadn't seen him for forty-one " or forty-two years. It sure was wonderful to see him.
SAM: How often did you have to haul water?
ED: Mostly every day. Nearly always. With so many, why, Mrs. Ingerhauled, but she had a truck. Her husband worked too. They all did. But she'd only get one barrel. Then there was a pond that we used to have to go and dip out of. That any fun either.
SAM: You just dipped it with a pail?
ED: Just a pail.Not at the well. That's where my youngest daughterlives now, where we used to dip the water.
SAM: How much would a barrrier hold?
ED: fifty-two gallons.
SAM: And you had how many of them?
SAM: Did you have to be careful to conserve that water?
ED: Yes. And we had one big white faced cow. We watered it in a tub.Put holes in it and sucked on it and held it in the tufa. And this big white faced cow, she'd stand there and drink and drink and drink, and pretty soon, she couldn't drink, but she'd hold her mouth in the water, and she was so big around. If she'd have walked she'd have rattled. And if anything else'd come up and I'd come up the other side, and I used to get a stick.I just loved her, but I had to get a stick anyhow make her get out of You know, she'd look at you, just like'what'd you do that for But she knew that the next day she might not get a drink. If I went over there and somebody got ahead of me,why then, they " get any water.
SAM: How long did it take for the water to come back once it was pumpeddry?
ED: Usually about twelve hours or fourteen, in the well. otherplace up above there it'd run a little stream most of the time, and we just dug out with a shovel and made a place where you could dip with a bucket. And of course, the pond, you had to put a board in it so you'd have a solid place to step.
SAM: How many, families do you think were drawing water that way everyday?
ED: There two families of Ingers. There was a younger family, butthey usually didn't use much water, and they didnnt have children or stock or anything. But Ingers had some stock. And then, Austins had horses and cows both. They didn't have any hogs. But here I was with hogs and cows and horses both, and kids. I tell you, that was an ordeal. But when I started to teach in'45, we got a man to comebuild us a pond, so we never had to haul for the stock any more. And I'll tell you, that was sure a big relief.
SAM: Well, you were married right when the Depression was breakingpretty badly.
ED: Yes. Right at the worst, I think. Boy, the awful lot of venison wehad to eat during that Depression. I guess we were happy that it was running around there. And the sheriff didn't say anything, you know. if you'd havd wasted some of it, probably, reported right now. But I don't think anybody in there wasted any.
SAM: Do you think anybody in Park was really up against it to haveenough to eat?
ED: Yes. We had an elderly lady there that many, many times didn't haveenough to eat. Mrs. Orlick. Poor old thing. We used to fix up thmgs take to her, and I think then, she stretched them out til she didn't eat them all at the same time, so she'd have a little more to eat for a while. Anyhow, she got a cold. And I suppose, pneumonia. Maybe it was the 'flu, and passed away. I suppose four or five years after Ben and me moved over there.
SAM: Did Ben and the other men always have work during the Depression?I thought like at the mill and woodsaw operation closed down.
ED: Well, a lot of the time, he didn't have lots of work. But justabout the timee lost his job in the woods, the WPA came in there to build a new road. We had a terible road to Park, first. And the mud got deep. But during thDepression, the government who fixed up that WPA, you know what that was. It was work on the roaojand work on public things so people would have a job. And of course, he had a team, so he got paid fifty cents. They got a dollar a day and,, he got fifty cents for the horses. And most of the other men worked single handed so they only got a dollar. And I'll tell you right now, thirty dollars went a long ways, then. They repaired the road and put in some better bridges. I can't remember if they graveled them or not. I don't think they did. But they did corduroy a lot of it. That's where the horses came in. When they lay those logs in right close together, fix them so they've got tp stay there. Well, they did that. And that surely helped.
SAM: Was this full time work at that time for him?
ED: Yes. They finished one thing and then they might do another thing.So It lasted until the worst of it was over.
SAM: Was there much chance for get-togethers in Park at that time, or wasthat real different from what had been before?
ED: During the Depression,' nobody could afford to get together and theydidn 't... everybody was concerned with getting enough wood and enough feed and enough food and keeping things together, more or less, during the Depression. But now after the Depression.broke, why then everbody... we all went to the... did all the years that we were there, except, you know, during the Depression. We went to the schoolhouse either Friday or Saturday night and played cards. And instead of everyone taking something like we use to, you know, where I went to school, why they appointed two ladies, one of them would bring cake and one would bring sandwiches, and that was enough for the group. My little Clem learned to play pinochle when he was in the first grade. And some of them used to kick about playing with him. You know , he got right up there at the table, right with the other partners. Some of them, you know, would sit down, and he'd sit down across of 'em and,"Do I have to play with you?" after he played with him a little while, they found out he wasn't so bad to play with. He was lucky. I never saw anything like it. He might bid crazy. Snd the other fellow you know, would wonder where his brains were, but anyhow, when Clem said what he wanted, the other fellow would have it, and he'd lay down his, oh dear, he'd have a hundred aces or a thousand aces and pinochle and oh you never saw such a mess. I tell you, he was spoiled rotten for a while, because he was so lucky. He was a cute little rascal. And of course the other children were old enough, they played right along with the rest of us. Clem was three years younger than Ethel and Ethel and Don and Jerry and Anna all played.. They played pinochle for years and years and yearsu We must have got awful good at that, as much practice as we had.
SAM: When you were in Park, were there other women that had smallchildren at the same time as you?
ED: Yes. My first little girl had a twin. Mrs. Austin's daughter hada little girl the next day. No, her's was the day before. And Anna's was the fifteenth of February, and their little girl's was the fourteenthAnd those little girls had lots of fun together. They grew up together. I guess they een each other for a long time now, but anyhow, Marjorie lived in Spokane for a while, and whenever she'd come down, she'd come and visit Anna. But I don't know where she is now. I haven't heard of her. Anna may know where she is. I don't know. When Clem started to school, there were four other little children to start to school in the community. And then one family moved away, that was Hughes'. About Christmastime, another family' moved away. "P hated to lose that family, they had the most kids in school. And they moved to Deary. And now that little girl works up here in, those people that moved away, their little girl, works up here in the Antelope Inn in Kendrick. Where they have booze over the counter. That's the way she turned out. And then, Ingers'had a little one. They had one after that. After I finished teaching in Park, their little girl started to school. the one I told you drove the truck and hauled the water.
SAM: The community was largely Norwegian, wasn't it?
ED: Yes. You didn't want to dare say this was a Swedish community. Theyfelt that very strongly that this was a Norwegian community.
SAM: Did you go to the church there?
ED: No. I never went to the church but once.
SAM: It was a Lutheran church, wasn't It?
ED: Yes. It was built by donation. It was many years old when we movedover there.
SAM: Did that make you feel apart from most of the community, in that youwere different background, or did that matter at all?
ED: It didn't seem to matter, not at all. There was a nurse in thecommunity too. We were the only two educated ones. And they moved out quite a long time before I left the community.
SAM: Did she practice while she was there?
ED: She would help if you needed. I know, Ethel had pneumonia and wetook her up there to their home for a little while, couple of weeks. She had her own family, she couldn't leave home. If you were really sick, why she'd take you in and take care of you. Just a real nice person.
SAM: When did you first have dealings Frank. Brockje. and thebank?
ED: All the time, it seemed like. I know the first time I ever went tothe bank, and Ben had been there quite a few times before, I met Olie Bowman and that was the man that had taken Frank into the bank with him. He seemed like such a nice old fella, and then when I got outjpand said what a nice fella Mr. Bowman seemed to be, they said,"Yeah, he's a nice guy as long as you pay your dsbts." But,I'll tell you right now, he can be something else. And you know, I've often thought.how true that was. He was sure always nice to us. Mr. Brocky's always been wonderful, too. But Mr. Brockg, waa years and years younger than Mr. Bowman. Mr. Bowman had the bank first. He was the sole businessman. It was in, I don't know '" it was in any place else or not, but it was in Deary, when I knew about it. And then, they moved to Troy.
SAM: Well, he, Olie Bowman, always willing to stand by your husband andhelp him?
ED: We never did ask for very much. You used to ask for fifty dollars,or sixty dollars, or something, you know, but he was always wonder ful about it, always. Both of them were always wonderful. More times then times when we could, when came due, we couldn't pay it. They'd rait a little while on us. But then they always had, even for that luch, they always knew how many cows, and how many horses, and how many hogs you had. And what equipment you had, you know,and if you had intended to beat the whole thing, why they would have sold you out. Like Frank says on his tape, they never, unless somebody did act awful, they never did try to sell them out. And I think that's very true, because that's the way it seemed to me, like. That if you anywheres near tried to treat them decently, you know, they would help you and not push you too hard, either. Both of them kind of had a way of talking to you, well ,"If you sell a couple of those cow, why, you bring us the money." "We'll go along for a little while longer." And something like that, and I thought it was wonderful. I always did. Because, here at Kendrick, they never were like that. Just never. I know one time after I married Vester that, the banker here was Kaneckabergi for years. They had a Mr. Carrol there before, and he was a mighty nice fellow. I know, my father dealt with him several times. But, anyhow, they got this Mr. Kanec kaberg in there. After Vester and I were married. Vester had a bunch of cows that he was fattening to sell. By the time the note came due, that he'd borrowed from the bank, the cattle weren't really top shape, he wanted to feed them a couple of weeks longer. Nbw this has been about twenty years ago. At that time when you sold cattle,you know, well, the buyers would think,"Well, they'd like to be fed a couple of weeks longer. We can't pay that much for them. They aren't quite prime. Or, real thick. We'll get them a pretty good price". They'd talk it over together and sometimes you got almost nothing for something after they'd looked at it. Well, Kaneckaberg wouldn't help Vester. He'd borrowed two hundred to buy feed for them to fatten them. And so he went back and said They're he'd like to buy some more feed, he said, quite ready to go to market. I believe in two weeks that they'll be prime." And Kanecaberg wouldn't loan it to him. So, he sold them. Hec/never dealt with Troy. I tried to get him to. He finally did go to it, though. But he sold those cattle and he got a terrible low price for them. The things he thought of Mr. Kaneckaberg weren't nice.
SAM: Had he dealt with them before?
ED: Yes. Well, he lived right here in the community,
SAM: You would think that he would have good credit with the bank.
ED: He did haveJBut Kaneckaberg was just like that. And he was theschool board head one. What do you call him? The clerk of the board. He was stinker there too, I'll tell you. He signed a couple a three of my contracts, and, oh boy. I sure was never toe well pleased with him. He's out of the banking business. He and his wife live here in Kendrick.They come to Senior Citizen Club. I don't visit with them, nor I don't ... well, let's ., say leave them alone. I don't try to befriend them, nor I don't try to do anything wrong to them.
SAM: In talking to various people around Troy, Including Mr. Brocke. Ialways got the idea that the bank was always concerned with the welfare of the people.
ED: In their communities. The banker makes all the difference in the worldfor their community. And it's just one of those things, but, Kaneck aberg was just like that, that's all. In another year or two, I got Vester convinced he was, afraid, you know, if he went out of his community, you see, Troy was clear out of our dealings here. You've got nothing in Troy. You go to Lewiston or Kendrick or go to Orofino. I finally got him to go up to Mr. Brocky and talk to him. They got along just wonderfully from the start. Vester couldn't even believe it himself. He was so happy with him. They were happy with each other, because Frank always acted like he just thought Vester was wonderful. Vester sure thought that of him.
(End of side D)
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9:00 - Her desire to become a teacher from childhood; Cold Springs school; cooking for family; social life centered on school
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Segment Synopsis: Growing up she wasn't deprived of much that she wanted. She began cooking meals while her mother worked in the field when she was eight. Her desire to become a teacher from childhood. A family on every 160. Cold Springs (or Agatha) School dwindled from fifty to ten; it was on the road from Lewiston to Orofino. Social life was centered on the school during the term.
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56:00 - Going to high school in Orofino and Lewiston; work as a servant for dinner parties; getting teacher certificate
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Segment Synopsis: Venison during the depression. A woman who went hungry in Park. WPA work for her husband. Lack of getting-together in Park during the depression. Card playing at the school on weekends; her son's luck at pinochle as a youngster. Children and families. She didn't attend the Lutheran Church. She and a nurse were Park's "educated" people.
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