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This converation with Frances Vaughan Fry took place at her home in Kendrick,Idaho on February 18, 1977. The interviewer is Sam Schrager.
FRANCES VAUGHAN FRY: Heavy snows. But you cant tell people, a lot of peoplearound here, you can't tell these people of the snow we used to have. We used to have- well, it wasn't anything to have three or four feet. And, oh, a lot of times it would, you know, blow, what do they call it? Drift? Well, we had to go and get them drifts and everything out of the way before we could get out. And I've saw times— we lived about a half a mile, yeah, about a half a mile from the main road up on Cedar Creek there. And we had to- the menfolks was going to take a- they had abob, you know we had the double Bobsled and they just took the front bobs and made a bob out of it and was coming to Kendrick. And they started down the lane and the menfolks had to go ahead of the horses and break the trail so they could get through, because it was so deep. But I don't know what winter it was, it was a long time ago, well, land we never thought anything of shoveling out road. And then one year we had snow til way up in May. And there was a man that ran out of hay, didn't have any hay for his stock, and the snow had crusted. And everything could on the snow, the horses and the cattle and pigs and everything was out. Everybody's cattle was out, all over the country. Everybody had everybody else's cattlel And they drove right across the ridge that would come into our place off the main road, they'd come in kind of slantchways to the barn. They drove right in there with a bobsled and got a load of hay and drove right back out over the tops of the fence any everything. Now, people won't believe 1 Some of these young honyaks around here, they won't believe it, when you tell them that. They think you're just talking.
Sam Schrager: Honyaks?
FVF: Yeah, honyaks. (Chuckles)
SS: I've never really heard that,
FVF: Oh, that's a what we called some people.A They just won't believe thingslike that. Why, it wasn't anything. We went one time, one time we went- when my oldest son, I think, was just a baby, now that's been sixty some years ago- we went over to our neighbor's and they had to go down about three-quarters of a mile or approximately a mile, down to their place and we had company and we were in the bobsled and the mfcnfolks had to go- it took us over three hours to go that distance.
SS: How far?
About- oh, it was about- possibly a mile down the lane and they had togo ahead and the road for the horses, so the horses could get down there with the sled.
SS: How would they break the road? Just walking along?
FVF: Yeah, they'd go ahead of the horses first and then the horses'd comealong. Course if the horses had to break the road, the horses'd leap, you know jump. out when they walked and just kind of made the trail, and then the horses could walk right in, and things like that. But we done that many a time.
SS: Was there much time say in the winter, that you would not go anyplace,that you would have to stay at home?
FVF: No. We nearly always- oh, of course, there'd be days we wouldn'tget out for maybe a day or two, but then the neighbors always- see we lived within possibly- well, it was a mile, some was a mile and a half mile and a quarter, a mile, or something like that, or three-quarters of a mile. get out and shovel out a road to the main road. Well, we done that lots of times.
SS: I wonder what's happened that's changed the cold and snow pattern somuch, that now we don't have the snow and winter that we used to.
Oh, no, nothing like that. And then that one winter,lots of snow, too, that winter. That was the winter I don't remember what winter it was, other people could tell you the exact winter it was, but now we lived on one side of the neighborhood up there; we lived on the side out this way farther and our neighbor lived back farther towards$ lder Creek country, and it was always ten degrees colder over at his place. We had around thirty and he had forty degreesit was that cold. And oh, the stock and all that- the animals and every thing, we had to make- of course then, we used to thresh and have big stacks of straw. Those cattle'd go over there and in, burrow under, you know, and eat in, when they didn't have ashed. We had sheds for most of 'em, but then they was times when we didn't have sheds for all of 'em and the rest of 'em would go over there around these piles of straw and just get as near in as they could, you know, under that straw Jit was so cold. But that was the only winter that I remember that was so cold. We've had cold weather. Since we've been down here we've had some cold weather because my daughter and I used to walk fromwe lived out by the- where the schoolhouse is now, we lived out there. We were both of us working down here and we'd come down the railroad track. We used to walk down the railroad track. Well, lots of times it was twenty below when we'd walk down the railroad track.
SS: How far were you walking to town?
Well, from out here the schoolhouse is into to town here, and wecame down the railroad track. And there was lots of mornings it was twenty- Now. that twenty degrees didn't mean too muchl^There was no wind. If it was just quiet, but, oh, if there was a wind you'd just pretty near freeze to death. And that's the way it is, of course, now. We had a few cold days, even this winter we've had a few cool days, But it is nothing like we used to haveJ
SS: Did you used to have to worry about the stock getting too cold in thewinter?
FVF: No. We had barns and sheds and all that they could someway get kindof out of the cold. We had a big cow barn and a horse barn, and then of course, we had our hog pens and all houses for them, and all. No, the stock was pretty well taken care of as far as that was concerned. Course, our hay was in the barn, and we could just feed 'em right out of it. We never had any trouble. We had to maybe shovel our path to the barn and like that. I know the. night that it was so awfully cold up there- during the time that it was so awfully cold, so many people lost all their chickens. Their chickens just froze right in the coops. And I know my neighbor lady, she had built a new chickenhouse, and one of those real cold nights, one of my children were born. And I just fussed all night long because I thought, well, my chickens freeze to death. And I'll tell you what I had my chickens in, and that was an old building, oh, it was a pretty good size shed, and they roosted in this old shed; it wasnit a real chickenhouse, they roosted in this shed. But they was up here, right at the top- it was built like thisthe roof was down like this and then they was pieces up here at the top. Well, those chickens was all up on that- up there, and I never lost a frozen chickenI But this lady that had this new chickenhouse lost hers, because there was so much moisture in there, with the chickens in there. There was so much moisture in there that they everyone of 'em froze! Now, that's unbelieveable maybe, but that was so.
SS: Is that because it was built too tight?
FVF: It was . tight and chickens, I guess they kind of sweat or somethinglike that, and they just froze. But then there was a lot of people that lost 'em. They had regular chickenhouses and they lost their chickens. But these of mine was up there in the top and they never froze. And I was worried because I knew they weren't fed or taken care of that evening.
SS: Well, how come somebody else in the family didn't—
FVF: Well, they were there but nobody else tended the chickens but me. Sothey didn't get any attention that time.
SS: Was that how you- that you had certain things you did, and only youdid them?
FVF: No, there was things that they did but other people didn't think aboutit, when it wasn't their- well, Mr. Fry wasn't any hand to do chores as far as that concerned, and I managed the chores and things like that.
SS: That's what I was thinking, I mean, I got the idea that a lot of farmfamilies, that there were certain chores that the wife did and things that the husband did.
FVF: There was a lot of that, too, but, it was just like the milking, I always did the milking. We had about five or six cows most of the time. I did the milking until one of the boys got big enough to help me. And then one of the boys helped me and one helped their Dad. I had two boys pretty close together.
SS: Did that take very long to milk six cows?
FVF: No. I don't know, maybe anywhere from a half to an hour. We had somegood cows, too. We had some that— we had a cow, and there's not very many people had a cow like that- we had one cow that we raised the fa mily almost! with. She was a big cow, she weighed- well, when we sold her she weighed 1,800 pounds. And she give the best milk that was ever invented. And the children could tell if I put any other milk on the table but this cow's milk. They'd say, 'What's the mat ter with,"- now, let's see, what was her name? Muelly, Ibelieve we called her. "What's the matter with Muelly?" We had a- well, at the time we had shorthorns and we had jerseys and we had this- she was a big roan. Meanest thing that ever walked on four legs, but she was the best cow you ever saw. And one time there was afellow come up there to work and when she first came fresh, she lost her first calf, and we didn't know she'd lost it, the neighbor had bought her, she was had sold to this neighbor. And so when she came fresh, she was down in the canyon, this neighbor never got her and something got her calf. Well, he didn't know it til it was too late and he just let her go, so that before she calved the next time, why, we bought her back.
It was the year of election, all betting on this and everybody was selling somethingor buy ing something at that time and we bought that cow back. She was acow then and she was^rreshen that spring. Well, she did, she freshened. And, oh, she was the biggest thing ans she gave the most milk and all. I swore up and down, my husband was no hand, he wouldn't milk. He just wouldn't milk, and oh, sometimes he had to, buttery seldom. Ihad a little Jersey and held always milk this little Jersey. But this old big cow, she was the one that we depended on for many years. And so she had her calfs. Well, she'd never been milked. Of course they'd never milked her when she had her first calf, they'd never milked her. So when we got her, she had the calf, we never milked her, we just put three calves on her. We left three calves on her all summer and she nursed these three calves. And then when wintertime come and we needed some milk, cow milk, our other cows, Iguess were dried up. So we had ahired boy there with me and he went to the, oh, it was when they was having a fairfdown at Lewiston there. The regular fair that they al ways had horses and cows and all things like that. He went to the Fair and he took these three calves off this cow, and my land, it wasn't but a day til this cow couldn't hardly walk, you know she had a big bag and she couldn'. So, I told this boy, I said, "Well, if you'll go with me out to the barn, I'll try to milk that cow." Well, by the time he got back I was milking the cow. And she was just real- she was kind of a, you know, nervous cow, and you couldn't change milkers on her. She didn't want anybody else to milk her but the one that was used to milking her, like me, I milked her all the time pos sibly that I could. And nojbne else did. So, I milked her for years. But that cow about once a month, she would kick. And we tried to put these kickers on her, but they wouldn't hold her, she'd just- they just went everywhere. So I'd just have to milk her and if sh e kicked me, why, I'd take it! Well, we had had a man there that did try to milk her without, you know, the kickers, and he went out there- and everytime he went out to the barn we could hear him fighting that cow. He would whip her he did everything he could do, and so finally I told my hus band, I said, "I'll milk her." So I got to milking her. So I'd milk her all-time, but once in a while when she took a notion to kick, and she didn't kick to miss you, she'd kick to hit you, and you usually got it!
FVF: Yes sir. And I'll tell you what she gave- it was before your time-I don't suppose you ever saw a square can coal oil, that we used to come to town and get a five gallon can of coal oil for our lamps; they were about that big square. Well, they held over five gallon. Well, after the oil was out of 'em, we cleaned 'em up good, and that's what I took for that cow's milk. I had a small bucket that I milked in, and then I had this big bucket and I'd milk- many a day and day after day, every time I milked that cow, I got that five gallon can full.
SS: Every day?
FVF: Every day; twice a day. That five gallon can. And our neighbor wasup to our place and I went out to milk one morning and she says, "Well, what you going to do with all them buckets?" I said, " Going to milk the cow." He wouldn't believe it. Well, I did it, just the same. And we kept that cow til, well, just- we kept her for years and years and years. And finally she had twin calves, and then we had to get rid of her.
SS: How come?
FVF: Well, she just didn't do any good, you know. We had toilet her go.But she sure was a good cow. Now with the jersey; I had a separator, cream separator. With the jersey cow you could run her milk through the separator, well when you got the milk through the separator, there was nothing left in it, it was just nothing but milk- there was no cream in it at all. Well, this old cow's milk, you could separate it and you could skim it, and the cream would raise on it always. Now that was the kind of milk she gave.
SS: You said when you got that cow there, it was during an election andeverybody was betting? Now, did you win that cow on a bet or did you-
FVF: No, no, we were just betting. I know we bet somebody bet you a coltor somebody bet you this or bet you that. I think that was the year that I had three steers- seems to me like I bought those steers- my husband had- they were his, that is- possibly his, well, I bought those three steers for my own doings and he bought this cow. That's how we had the cow. He bought this cow back from this neighbor and I bought these steers from him. And one steer I sold for over $100. One steer died- and let's see now what happened to the other one- I got a $100 and one died, and there was something happened to the other one. And that's what went with my money that I bought those steers with and he still had his cow. (Chuckles) And oh, it was a great life. And we used to do those things. And I forget- I don't just remember- my brother won a coat, a mackinaw coat, from somebody that year.
SS: Was he betting Democrat or Republican in that year? On the president.
FVF: Oh, let's see, I don't even know.
SS: Oh, it doesn't matter.
FVF: No, I don't remember that.
SS: He won a mackinaw.
FVF: Yeah, he won a mackinaw. And then there was just quite a lot of, youknow, they bet money. Money in those days was money! (Chuckles) They didn't have too much.
SS: You know, one thing about milking cows; now, I've never done that, it'salmost past my time, to just be milking cows and I know some people still do. But when you went out to milk a cow like her, what kind of method did you use? I mean, did you take just a real direct approach, and not fool around at all?
FVF: We had them in stanchions. We had the cows in stanchions. Every cowknew where she belonged. So we had them in these stanchions and we'd usually feed 'em and then, of course, the other cows- there's a thing they called a figure eight- well, a lot of times we'd put the figure eight on the other cows, but this one we tried- we had these- it wa s a thing that you hooked over one leg and crossed and hooked over to the other leg. Well, she just kicked the thing all to pieces. You couldn't put 'em on her. She wouldn't let you, she'd just fight and just kick all the time, you couldn't do a thing with her. So, I just quit trying to put 'em on her. I used to always, when I sit down to milk, I had my milk stool and my bucket, you know, I'd sit down to milk and I'd put my head in the cow's flank. If it's a small cow you can put your head in a cow's flank and she can't kick you, maybe she tries to kick, she can't raise her leg because I had my head in there and I tried that with this cow, but it didn't work. She pretty near broke my neck. So I didn't try that anymore. And I'd just have to sit there, just pray that she wouldn't kick every time I went out there to milk, because you never knew when she was going to kick and when she wouldn't. So that was that one.
SS: But it wouldn't pay to try and hit her?
FVF: That's what they done in the first place. They whipped her. Theyjust took a rawhide, you know, one of them old blacksnakes and just, oh, this man that was working for us, and he was going to whip it out of her, but he never whipped it out of her, it just made her worse. You just touch her with anything, you know, and whip her, why that just made her worse. And she was one of these cows, she never bothered you. She never done a thing to you, you could go out anywhere among her, go around her, she wouldn't kick you. Just walk around where she was and things like that, but she was a cow that if she was out in the corral or out in the field or out in the pasture- you know, some of the cows you can kind of make a run at 'em and they'll take off like they're shot, but this cow, she never moved, you couldn't scare her. She wasn't afraid of nothin'. You just make a run at her and she'd just come right back at you.
SS: Do you think cows like that are fairly smart animals? I've heard peoplesay that cows are just dumb, and I somehow have the idea that they're not as dumb as people think.
FVF: We had two or three cows- we got several cows from- oh, went over toHarvard and got a couple of cows, they were kind of- well, it was from Clarence's cousin lived over there and we went over and got these and Elba land called 'em Pat and . They were good cows. Well, I could take my milk pails and start for the barn and the cows'd be - after we'd harvest we'd always turn the cattle in the fields, you know, and I'd holler- you know, call kind of to 'em, Pat and Elba, and here they'd come. Well, this one would try to beat the other one there and she'd come right up to me and I could sit down and milk her anyplace^. And I could milk her right in the corral, and I'd just take my bucket and stool and go out there and sit down. Which ever one got there first. And one would try to beat the other one. Oh, yes, they're smart. And the same thing when they'd go into their stalls, they had certain stalls, and one of 'em get in the wrong place and you'd just call 'em by name and boy, out of there they'd get and get over there. They knew where they belonged. No, no, cows are just as smart as anything else if you try to teach 'em anything. Well, anything around our place, the horses and cows and pigs, we could do most anything with.
SS: You know when you were talking about the- having a hired man; did youhave a hired man much of the time, helping on the place?
FVF: No. Only in the summer, just for :work,only when someone maybewanted a place to stay. Lot of times they'd be some man been working didn't have no place to stay and he'd come and say, "Well, I'll do chores for,"you know, get board and bed. Yes, there've been people do that lots of times.
SS: Would that be a neighbor man or would it be somebody that you ^know?Well, it would be someone that we knew, mostly. And then we did have a hired man quite a little bit in the spring for a long time til the children got big enough to help, we had ahired man in harvest and like that, you know, all the time. Otherwise than that we didn't have. Did he work with your husband mostly? Was that what he would do? Would he just work alongside of him?
No, he'd have his- he'd maybe take care of the horses or, you knowrun the teams out in the field or whatever they were doing. Plowing or whatever they were doing, why, one would do one thing and one'd do another And then he used to help me with the garden and different things like that, whenever he didn't have something else to do. But^hat was the time when we paid him, see. But in the wintertime, when there was prac tically nothing to do, why, only just chores, why we'd just have them there to do chores. And then sometimes Mr. Fry was away from home, he went- One year he was up in the woods, up hauling lumber from the si ding -or from the sawmill there on Boulder Creek over to the siding where the train'd come along on the track, you know. He was up there hauling lumber and different things and was away from home, this boy'd stay there with me.
When you had a hired man staying, were they just like a member of thefamily?
Oh, yes. They'd come in and sit down to the table and eat with us,iust the same as anybody else.
The harvest hands That was a great time. When we had harvest hands we just- All themen that was on the harvest crew, well before they had such a thing as- they had horses and wagons to haul the hay in- or the bundles into the threshing machine, and like that, and then we'd have the engineer and the man that hauled the water and the man that run the machine and the one that run the- when the horses went around on that- you know there was a certain team that hooked onto this- what'd you call it? a sweep, and it went around and round and round and that would run the engine- or the machine over here. We'd have anywhere from twenty to thirty men. That was a big time. Of course, we didn't have too much to thresh, just aday or two, that was all. They'd go to someplace else and each woman'd go and help the other woman with the crew when she had crew and things like that. We all helped each other in the harvest. And everything, like putting up ice- we were talking the other day, we used to always put up ice, you know. Why, the ice would be that thick, and we'd cut that ice. We had an old log cabin that we had sawdust in it; had for years, and w^d put that down in the sawdust and we had ice all summer. One neighbor'd help the other neighbor and we'd cut this ice and haul it to these places and cover it up.
SS: Was this log cabin just for your own supply?
FVF: Yeah, yeah. We'd and a lot of people'd run the water over it and let it all freeze in one big chunk and we'd have ice all summer. And you could take that ice- and right now you get a piece of ice and wrap it up in something and it isn't any time til it's gone. Well, we used to get those chunks about like that, and we had maybe old blankets or, something that we wrapped 'em up in- well, we could keep an ice chunk for a week. But, you can't do that anymore. out
SS: Did you cut the ice and then have parties going cutting it?
SS: Off the creek there?
FVF: Well, we had ponds.
SS: Oh, yeah, sure.
FVF: And then one time they could drive right out onto that, you know.They started ponds and then they could drive right out there and load up. And a time or two the teams went in the pondj^had to cut the harness off and everything else to get 'em back. You know, they went in there and the horses couldn't get loose and they just had to get in there and cut 'em loose. And we skated and everything on these. Well, it'd be that big square and oh, that thick, just in a big square. And they'd go out there with the saws and cut it off. One neighbor'd help the other
SS: Would you say that the women- farm women then, worked as hard as themen did?
FVF: Well, I always have said the women work harder than the men whereverthey are, and they do today. Because a man has so many hours of workjrt^ and when his hours is up, he's through. But a woman, if you had a family like we had, we had the children, we had the meals, we had everything else to do, besides helping with that. Until my of- my oldest boys was twelve years old, I went right out in the field and shoeked the grain behind the binder. And oh, that tickled my boys, they thought that was- why, they said,"Mama's not going to help us anymore." And so I just quit and the boys went on from there. But I helped in the field besides taking care of the family and all like that. I helped in the fields. And I'd do my milking and stuff like that besides— I don't know how I done it. But I did. Never thought anything about it. Most women, they didn't do all that. They didn't work outside and they didn't do a lot of things, and they didn't do chores or they didn't milk cows nor anything like that, but I did.
SS: You mean most of the neighbors even didn't?
FVF: Many of 'em.
SS: What made you different, do you think? What made you be like that?
FVF: Well, just thought it was necessary, 'cause we didn't haveanything else, we just had to make what we could on anything we could. We just had all this stuff and it was to be done.
SS: I mean, they all had pretty much the same thing to do?
FVF: Well, it was according to whether they had cattle or horses or whatthey had, they had to take care of what they had, but they didn't- a lot of 'em didn't have a lot of things to do other than justyou know their chores was very short. We always had plenty of chores because we had cattle and we had hogs and everything. The children and I took care of the hogs and cows.
SS: Do you think that your family was maybe more ambitious, that they weretrying to do more? Have more things?
FVF: Well, they helped to have more things. But then just like it was withour family, we taught our family as they grew up, we had chores for 'em to do. Now, that's what's the matter-
They don't even. There isn't a child, I'll bet in this town that knowswhat it is to carry in wood or to get wood. Oh, there was just different chores to be done- and they wouldn't no more know how to go out and feed a horse or a cow or anything- they wouldn't have no- know a thing about it. Well, if we went someplace; if Mr. Fry and I went someplace- I nearly always would take the youngest one with me- and then the rest of 'em- Grandma was there, and when they got old enough, they'd be there and be there for the day. We never did leave 'em nights very much, but we was gone sometimes but Grandma was always there with 'em. So, whenever we went away, if we came home late at night, those chores were all done. Our children done 'em. They never thought anything else. They we rit and done the milking and they tended to the stock and put the stock in and fed everything. They had to be fed night and morning and everything like that. There was nothing to it. They didn't know anything else. Then when they had time, maybe they'd go out and saw wood or maybe they'd go do this or do that. And they had their horses. Later years they all had ponies and things like that to ride and if there was- and oh, the kids wanted to go someplace they'd jump on their horses and away they'd go. They'd go fishing and like that, you know. But they had their time the same as we did and that was it! But they knew how to work. There isn't a one of my kids but knows how to work, and they know how to cook. There's any one of 'em can cook. They can do anything there is to do, always has been that way. Girls the same way.
SS: Do you think that's because you expected it of them when they were little?
FVF: Well, they had it to do. When they were little; my oldest boy^he knewwhat it was to take care of the younger ones, 'cause he took care of the younger ones. I had the other work to do and I did the main part of taking care of 'em, but then when I got 'em cleaned up and- for the day and all like that, he'd take 'em outside and play and we'd put 'em to nap, you know, and things like that, and then he'd have that time to play. But a lot of times he had the children- all these kids with him. I had eight. And the children'd go with him and I'd go ahead and do the work. But if they went anyplace then- after they got older, they went different places and they wouldn't get home at choretime or something like that, why, I always did the chores for them. Always. And they always did 'em for me whenever I was gone. There was no question tion about it; there was no questions asked.. If we didn't get home, the chores was done.
Well, on an average day, would you be helping your husband in the field?An average day, or was it just something special like shocking? Oh, no, I did lots of outside work, too.
SS: Like what? What else would you be doing?
FVF: Oh, well, Idon't know, just numerous things that was to be done. We'dhave the shocking and then we'd haul in hay and then I'd- we used to have to turn our shocks, we used to have to turn the . We used to raise beans. And the beans'd get wet, we'd have to turn 'em. And all of that stuff. I helped with all of that. And cutting the— well, we took one year- we had seed clover; it was late, you know, and oh, it got cold before we got it all cut, so I'd run the mower; rode the mower and drove the team, and Mr. Fry went along and raked it so it would get on there so we could gather it, and things like that. All those little chores like that I went along with his. We both worked at it. But this bean deal; why then, we just near wear the beans out a turning 'em over. It'd rain and rain and then we'd think we'd get to threshing 'em and then it'd rain some more Well, there was lots of funny things that we had like that happen. That happen didn't ,but then we always laughed about it. One year I took the children, and the beans that year when they cut 'em they cut 'em and they shattered so bad that they- beans, just lots of beans in the rows- that year we didn't have beans. And our neighbor, now he says, "If you and the children want to come over and pick upu they was pods and they was beans and we could pick up all we wanted to. So we went over and picked up many sacks of beans just in these rows, what was left, he wasn't going to do anything them; he wouldn't pick 'em up. You could rake 'em up or anything, you just had to pick 'em up. And they was pods and everything, we picked, the children and I and got, I don't know how many sacks. And things like that. And we out and we picked potatoes one year. We helped a man up there that put in potatoes and went and helped him with them. And when the children got big enough they went with me and we'd just go and-
SS: Did you have beans that year, that you picked his beans?
SS: you didn't grow any?
FVF: No. We didn't have any that year. He said, Well, if you want to goover, just go over and pick all you want. You can pick 'em just as long as you want to, and so we went over and picked quite a few.
SS: still trying to figure why most women didn't do the kind of workthat you did. I mean, that those farm families, they were in the same situation pretty much, weren't they?
FVF: Yes. but then they didn't do those things, they just didn't do those fcThey was one or two women that done just the same as I did. One woman that didn't have any family at all, she helped her husband like that all the time. But then, most of 'em, they kind of set around. Some of 'em. Now, I never- my children never went dirty, any time. I always managed someway- and the same way, they neveralways had the best in the world- But I never let 'em go to town or anyplace- course, they never went to town very often- but I never let my children go- but for many years I lived close to my mother and she helped me on that deal. She would help me mend the boys' pants and things, you know, they wear out their knees and stuff like that. Well, if I didn't get it done she'd come down and help me with it. Same way way with my stockings. I never let my children go anyplace, you know some people let their children go with great holes in their stockings. Course there's some of them comes now that. Why, I never let my children go like that. I MENDED THOSE CLOTHES. I said, a patch was was better than a hole anytime. And I mended my children's clothes, and everybody else's, as far as that's concerned. Because we had it to do. There was nothing else we could do.
SS: These women that would sit around more; know, that in the earlierdays, I've heard a lot of talk about how sickly a lot of women werethey had a hard time with their health. Was that what was going on with some of these women?
FVF: Some of 'em were, but some of 'em were just- they couldn't do it, thatwas all. Whether they weren't sick, but they just didn't do it. I had many a neighbor, just lovely neighbors, but they never done those things, They just never done a thing. They never mended their children's- they let their children just go with their pants and all, just all ragged and everything and they never done anything about it. Well, I did that. Of course, I didn't always keep it up because sometimes I was too busy to do that at the time, but I caught up later on.
SS: Did these women socialize a lot? I mean spend a lot of time-
FVF: Well, yes, yes. We'd go spend the day with one another and thingslike that and have a jolly time. And if we was doing something spe cial- well, just like maybe this woman'd have a half a dozen chickens to dress or something, well, this other woman'd come over and spend the day and help STout of the way and things like that. Yes, we spent many a day, pleasant day, with each other. And if they had something special maybe they'd have a quilting tie. Well, they'd get it ready and we'd go visit 'em and we'd tie the quilt or we'd do what ever they had. If they was cleaning house, we'd go and help with the painting. And we used to paint- you know, we used to take newspapers any kind of newspapers we used to save, all of our newspapers, and any kind of newspapers we'd save, just like papers like these, they were only this big, papers like that. My mother always straightened 'em out, laid 'em out, and in the spring we'd repaper our house. And things like that.
SS: With papers?
FVF: With these papers, and things like that. Sometimes we had a newspaperbut it was very seldom that we ever had a paper as big as the Tribune or anything like that. We had these kind of papers.
FVF: But not a newspaper big enough, you know. We saved every paper, andthen when it come time to clean house, why, we'd go help somebody else and they'd come and help us.
SS: But I'm speaking of like wasting time, that some of these women did.Imean, they couldn't watch soap operas on TV, because they didn't have a TV, they probably didn't have a radio either.
SS: I wonder what they did instead of the work that they maybe shouldhave been doing.
FVF: Well, I'll tell you, this is my work that I do, all this stuff, likefor the children and all that. And I've made bedspreads, I've made around thirty bedspreads for my grandchildren, my own children and my grandchildren. And I'm making pillow cases now for my great grand children. And all those things. I've been busy at that. If Iwasn't busy in the field Iwas busy at something like that in the house. But a lot of people would just sit down and just talk. They never done anything, Only just get the meals, they always had to cook three meals a day. One of our neighbors, the man, he wouldn't eat anything but biscuits. (Chuckles) So his wife always had to bake biscuits for every meal! So one day they had sickness in their family, so one time, he was quite afella to talk and tell things. So we nsed to have these dinners on Sunday. We usually had, oh, if we had apicnic or somebody's birthday or something, we'd all and Easter was one day we had, abig day, and we'd all take things, you know, and then we'd all cook and everybody'd, course, bring the best they had, and this man- he- Well, this is what I started to tell you about these biscuit deals-
Well, they didn't have a heating stove. They had their kitchenon one side of their- well, I guess they did have a heating stove in the second room, but on one side of a breezeway they had their kitchen, well, on the other side was their bedrooms and stuff like that, and he had- all of his wood, he had to cut short, you know, oh, fourteen or sixteen inch long wood and they'd split it for the cookstove. So one day he was sitting there and his wife was one of these- if ever was a^angel on earth, this woman was one of 'em. She was the best person I ever knew in my life.K She was the sweetest and the best I ever knew, and there was another neighbor the same way. And she was never any hand to complain, everything was just alright, nothing was complained of. Every once in awhile she'd- maybe Mr. Lang'd start in, he'd tell a story or something, and then one day, he was sitting and he was going on. He says, "I'd just like to see piled up in apile," he says, "I'd like to see the wood piled up in apile that Ihave split for that stove." So he went on about splitting this wood- had to split this wood, you see, small wood to go in the stove. And after he got all through going on, Mrs. Lang says, "Yes, Jim,"she says, "I'd like to see piled up in apile all the biscuits that I've baked in that." (Laughter) And tickled, it just tickled us all so. And she just lau ghed and she laughed and she got another good one on him like that. She didn't laugh about it but then she just told that and calm as a cucumber about it, and it just kind of shut him up for a while. And when we'd go to these big picnics he was always going on about this one or that one or something that he ate. Well, this was just deli cious and that was just delicious, and oh, he said to us one day when we was up to one of these big picnics; she had baked a cherry pie, his wife had, and boy, he was just talking about, "Oh, that was Ay/ZT such delicious cherry pie," a vjl would it be alright if he had another piece of that pie. But he just kept on talking about it and talking about it. And pretty soon she said, "Well," she says, "Jim," she says, "that's the way I baked 'em for the last so many years that we've been married!" And things like that tickled us so because she never would say anything only just once in a while like that. They all knew him so well and everything, so we thought it was pretty funny when she'd get off some thing like that.
SS: What was it that made her such an angel? That made her such a fineperson?
FVF: This Mrs. Lang? I never heard; I don't remember of ever hearing- andwe had another neighbor at the same time she was there- we had another neighbor that I never heard that neighbor ever say anything bad about anybody. You could be talking to either one of 'em, and of course, I say my say, if I don't like somebody or they do something, why, I'd say what I want to say- but it wouldn't make any difference, some of us'd be talking about some of these neighbors doing so and so and this and that and the other, and whatever was their fault- whatever we could see was their fault and all like that, these women aould, each one of 'em, always say, some part, something of these people, some good of 'em. It never went any farther, it was always something good. If they couldn't say something good, they didn't say anything at all. And they could always do that. And some of 'em that were real renegades, you know, why, we'd be talking about 'em, but these women, they always could say something nice about these people that we talked about. And, you know that's something most people don't do. That is, don't say or tiohMdo or don't stay by- is to see something good in everybody. No matter what they did, it didn't make any difference. If they did that, why there was something else they Could say good about them. That's the reason I say these two women, if there ever were a Christian on earth it was0them women. And what I can't see through was, and I guess never can, any of us can, why those two women had to suffer- oh, both of 'em.
how they did suffer before they passed on, Just something terrific.And I can't understand that. So I don't know why the reason was, but those women were, I think they were two of the best- they weren't the best maybe, but they were two of the best that I ever knew. And I never expect to know anybody that was as sweet as those two women.
SS: It sounds like Mrs. Lang took a certain amount of guff from her husband, too.
FVF: Oh, she did. She never crossed him. She never said anything, I don'tthink. Whatever he done, why that was done and she never- or anything. And I know his daughter one time. They moved finally, moved from Cedar Creek down to Juliaetta and somebody said something to the girland he was one of the assessors up here at Moscow one time and some thing was said about having money and this girl she says, "Well," she says, "I think he's rich." That was about her dad. She said, "I think he's rich because he always kept anything he got." (Chuckles) But he was a great guy. Oh, all of these experiences and things we went through, when we were And us kids was scairt to death of him, kids. We were scairt to death of this man. They had children the same age as me and I used to go and help 'em plant beans and things like that. Boy, we'd surely scoot out of the way when he showed up! Because we didn't like him too well.
SS: Did he show a temper to the kids?
FVF: No. No, I never ever saw him. But his kids, I'll tell you right now,they knew what it was to work. Boy, they had to do the work, that was all there was to it. Now, I never asked my children, any one of my children, I never asked my children to ever do anything that Iwouldn't do myself. If it come right for me to do it, I could do it myself, but Inever asked my children to do wouldn't do If they had to do something and I could help 'em along with it, I'd be right by the side of 'em. And there are several men that I know- this man that I'm talking about, Jim Langdon, his boy, now he made his boys work, when he had boys later on. And he made his boys work. But that man worked right along to the side of them boys. He never asked them to do this or do that just because it was a hard job to do, he worked right along with them, and I did the same thing with my children. I never told my children that he had to do something that I wouldn't do myself.
SS: But the old man, the old man, he was more that way. He would expectthe kids to do things he didn't want to do.
FVF: He'd tell the kids to do this or do that and do somethingAhe wouldn'tdo himself. Never did. He never did.
SS: It's funny, sounds like some of these men, even like your husband somewhat too, were kind of finicky about what they'd do and what they wouldn't do.
FVF: Well, they were. There's lots of things, I suppose maybe that I shouldhave done that I didn't do, but at the same time, I figured- well, I never figured that- I did my part in raising the family and having the family. And I don't ever think that I ever infringed on his- When he wanted to go; he'd go. And he was always fishing and he was always doing this and he was always doing that. Well, when I had a baby in my arms, I didn't want to go fishing and like that or take my children out like that, because it was too much trouble to watch 'em when I was on the river or any place to watch those children and I figured they had to be watched because they weren't used to it, and I was afraid they'd get drownded or something. Well, I figured that that was more trouble than to have 'em at home, because they could go anyplace they wanted to there at home. They could go and play. And they usually had an old horse they could have, or something like that and they were busy. And kids'd come in to see them, or they'd go to see some of the kids and they were happy at home. I said, "I'm not going like that until I haven't the children." And so I never went too much, but he went. Away he went to California and he fished. He went every year fishing and hunting and all of that stuff. So one of the neighbors, one ofN neighbors up there, she said her husband took a notion to go hunting with him a time or two, and so she said to me one day, she said, something about her husband, now when he come home and she hadn't done something that he figured- she didn't do it like he did, see, and when he came home, why he kind of grumped about it. So she said to me, and she was an awful friend, too, she said to me one day, she said something about Clarence, hetfsay that. I said, "No, he don't." I said, "He hadn't better either." Because I said, "When he goes away, I do those chores and things that he done all the time, I do 'em the best I know how, and the best I can under the circumstances and everything." I said, "If he has anything to say, he can stay home and do it, I'm not going to." I wouldn't—
SS: So really, it sounds like when you had kids that he really had moretime and more freedom to come and do as he pleased.
FVF: He did. He just did. He went and he come and he got what he wantedand his mother- he was the only- well, they had some other children, mother- he had a couple of- a stepsister and a two brothers, but they were grown, and he was the baby, and he had His folks give him everything he wanted. everything he wanted and anything he wanted. And he had everything he wanted as things come along as long as the money lasted he got it. But when the money was gone then that was a different proposition. Somebody else had to kind of plan on that. So, I done what I could and as I say, when he was gone- and like I used to go out and cook for the crews after the children- I took my three kids with me. And I was up to Clarkia. I was up between here and oh- Up tanuand oh, just different places. I went and took my three children. Well, I got the women's wages, whatever they were paying their women. They always paid a man cook a lot more than they ever paid a woman cook. And why? It always was that way. I didn't get paid- I didn't get paid as much as the lowest man in the crew got for just what he done. And I was up from anywhere from four o'clock in the morning til after nine at night, getting my things straightened so I could cook. Course, I had my three kids with me. I got my board along with it, and I con sidered that quite a little bit with my three kids. I had them with me.
SS: What kind of camps were these? Were they just the log camps in thewoods?
FVF: Yes, with loggers and haulers and everything like that.
SS: How many men in a camp like this?
FVF: Well, in the one up at Breakfast Creek that I cooked for up there, hadthirty. But I did have a helper there. Then the missus, the man's wife , she come up a lot, she had children just the same as mine and she used to come up and help me too in the summer. But i was there a lot of the times, just by myself. Now, I baked my own bread and I made all of my sweets up and the boss told me, "Now," he told me, "you make cookies and you make all this sweet stuff, he says, when you're doing that, why that's taken offa something else." Well, he provided, he provided everything, he was the best guy you ever saw to work for. And we had to have hotcakes- well, we had all kinds of cold cereals, then if there was some of 'em in the crew had to have some hot cereal, I made hot cereal. We fried three and four dozen eggs every morning. And we had hotcakes and cookies. But I had a helper right at mealtime, and they called him a—
FVF: Flunky. But he was a- well, he worked out on the loads, when he wasn'thelping me. If I needed him, I called him, because he'd help me he'd peel potatoes and he always fried the eggs of a morning. And then I'd do the rest of it.
SS: He was making more money than you too?
SS: Well, you had all that responsibility.
FVF: I had all that responsibility, every bit of it, but this man that furnished, why he'd get- you know the men had to make their lunch. They made their own lunch. I fixed the stuff and they made their lunch. Well, he'd get those big rolls ofKmeat, this, oh, you know that big baloney that they use so much- that's what the men liked, was that. Well, any other kind of meat they didn't care for. Sometimes he'd get a chunk of it, so them didn't like it. Then we had hams and bacon and shoulders and every kind of meat we could get. We got fresh meat whenever we could, but when we were away up there in the timber, he would come to town maybe twice a week and get groceries and he'd always get fresh meat when he came. But we couldn't always keep fresh meat, we didn't have no place to keep it. So, it was always this other meat that we had. And sugar, he got by the sack. A sack of brown sugar, white sugar, any kind of sugar wanted. We had all the flour and everything there was to do with. But then, it was quite a job to make bread for all of them. In later years we bought bread. For a lot of years you had to make the bread for the sandwiches and everything, and it took a lot of bread.
SS: Uh-huh. Did you have to watch the kids at the same time as you wereworking?
FVF: Oh, yes, but that was nothing. We lived right by the river but ther\4^kids were big enough at the time I was there. But when we was up at some of those other- but when we'd go fishing or something like, we'd go up on the river, you know up the river, and there was such deep holes. Well the^ deep holes there, but the children got used to it. When they got used to it, why they could play where ever they wanted to. And they were out in the river most of the time, that is out around camp they never went too far away from camp. But they were always outV she was up there with her kids, she had three or four, and they were all out together. The kids were.
SS: Well, how hard a work was that? Were you working most of the time.,from morning til night?
FVF: Well, if I got my work , I could sometimes have a little time inthe afternoon. It wasn't much of the time, I was busy most of the time. You know doing something, if I wasn't doing bread or making cake or baking pie or something like that. We had pie and cake and cookies all the time. And some men take, when they fix their lunch, they'll take most of the cookies and stuff like that and then others'11 take other things. But mostly they liked the cookies and cake, stuff like that.
SS: What were the lumberjacks like? Were they real polite, courteous?
FVF: I never.had to ask a one, not one man, to ever, that he wasn t doingwhat he should be. And one thing that they were very courteous about and was very nice about; when they got up from the table they would clean up^their plate, put everything on their plate and bring that to my worktable. And then all I had to do was scrape that off and put it in my pans. But they'd always clean their plate and^ set it on my table and I didn't have to go to the table and gather up. And then this man that I had helping me, he would come in, but I never had him come in very many times because I didn't need him and I didn't have him because I had the whole day. The men took their lunch, you see, I didn't have to fixk . But I did have to have breakfast and supper. But, let's see, they come in around oh, six, o'clock, I guess at night, something like that, and then we got up and they were off to work by seven the next morning, things like that so, it wasn't too bad. I don't know how I done it, but I done it. I couldn't do it now. I couldn't even think about it, but I sure could do it then.
SS: Did you have a cabin to live in?
FVF: I lived in the backend of their cookhouse. We had a big cookhouse.And big long tables. There was two big long tables in the cookhouse and I cooked right up in the corners.
SS: The kids slept there with you?
FVF: Yeah, we had beds back in there If we wanted to, Or some of the boysthey put up atent, they put aplatform back of the cookhouse and had an extra tent on that and if we had extra, why, they'd go back there and sleep. And they had big bunkhouses and all that. How often did you get home when you were doing that? Well, sometimes I- about every two weeks, Ithink. Stayed overnight and went back the next day, and it took us about four or five hours, 4Hen we drove,I And sometimes I went We had to stop between here and getting back to camp, we had to stop and stay all night. One night we stayed with aman up here, he was a bachelor and he asked us to come in. As it happened it rained that night and he asked us to come in and we all went in with our sleeping bags and everything, and he just turned the front rooms over to us and we just all of us just bedded down right in that front room. But we had all the horses and all the equipment and everything, and we had started in and we didn't get in and we stayed there and then,went on in the next day.
SS: You took the horses—
FVF: Right with us. We was traveling with the - well, the whole crew wasgoing in. That was after we was situated up- see, we went back and forth clear up to Breakfast Creek for several years and was up there. And of course, then we'd go in and we'd come out in the fall. Did you have much to do when you got home? Just to stay over night, was there must work to do at home?
I didn't do much, no. Because Mr. Fry was working, too. He was awayfrom home, so Ididn't have much, only just for ourselves. And then after later years, why then he was home, and he'd just cook for him self and like that. But I used to work around here, you know. Any thing Icould get to do; I've clerked -Ihad at that time- clerked in tof the stores around here and then Iwent out with a doctor, just mos lots and lots of times. And went on cases, baby cases with him, you know, then I'd stay with the people^about thirteen days, each one, and like that. I used to go out like that, too. But then the children were old enough at home then that they could just make it alright at home without me. And then later on, why, Mr. Fry was home. But when he was home, why none of the children was ever home with him, because they were either working.
SS: This going out with the doctor- did you do that very much?
FVF: Well, I did for a good many years. I wasn't a nurse. I never tookany nurse's training, but I got in with the doctor and whenever they'd have a case maybe that they couldn't find anybody to go and he'd come and get me and I'd go with him and then I'd stay til they was through with me. You know usually, at that time, why, they figured that a wo man should stay down for thirteen- twelve, thirteen days, and I?d get that besides going out with the doctor. I used to do that quite a bit. There's quite a few of the kids around here that I took care of 'em when they IsfHcand I had my picture taken with one here the other day that- he's get a kid now. And so we had our picture taken to gether. And I said to his dad after he was born, I said, - I told his mother, I said, "He was the ugliest baby I ever saw." You know, his dad was sore at me for quite a while afterwards. He said to her, "I don't think he's ugly." But he was agreat big baby, long, you know, and so poor, he just looked like a little bird, you know, that is, his hands and all. And then I teased him about it after I found out it made him kinda sore, then I teased him about it. He's gone now. This young fellow that I took care of, he's around.
SS: What kind of pay did you get for staying at a place for almost twoweeks, like that?
FVF: Oh, I got anywhere from, oh, I don't remember, five, ten dollars maybe for staying with them, something like that. Not too much. Well, most of 'em were people that, you know, that just really couldn't af ford anything more and I never asked anything more, but I'd go and stay. I stayed with Alvie Craigson up here on the Ridge, and oh, I went different places. And then I took care of a good many of my dau ghters when they had their babies.
SS: Did you help the doctor do the delivery, too?
FVF: Well, I was there, I took care of 'em,. One time I went- ourneighbors up there raised turkeys, and they lived over on- at Boulder Creek- you've been to Boulder Creek?
SS: Oh, yes.
FVF: Well, these people lived over in Boulder Creek, and they were to havethis baby. Well, he started to Kendrick with his wife; his wife was taken, you know, it was time for her baby, and they got as far as my place, I wasn't home. I was down at this neighbors helping 'em pick turkeys. I went down there and they had,oh, I don't know, how many turkeys- hundreds of 'em to pick. Well, I'd been down there a day or two when they brought her to my place, and when they got there one of the - So, I was down to this woman's, down there helping them with those turkeys. They had a whole crew, and we were down there, and they called me; and this woman got over far and the neighbor man he wanted to bring her on into town, and he says, "What do you want to do, kill that woman?" And they stayed right there and she had her baby. Well, they just wrapped the baby up and the doctor tended to her and everything and when I got home- they called me and I went home- and there was that baby. I said, "That's the first time there ever was a baby at Fry's house when she wasn't home!" (Chuckles) But I took care of her for a few days.
SS: Did she stay at your house?
FVF: Yes, she stayed right there, then she *rent home again. We often laughedabout that, because I'd rather picked turkeys, but I stayed there, took care of her. So I'd start in on that, so I was just from place to place. And I'd go most any place around whenever they needed someone maybe harvest time or something like that, why I'd just help with there was to be done, that was it. And so that's the way my life went.
SS: it seems like to do that kind of work though, there sure wasn't muchmoney in it?
FVF: No, there wasn't too much money, but then money was hard to get. AndI'd just go whenever I could, and when it was so I could leave the children. One time our house caught afire the night before, we was waiting for a woman, that she was to have her baby, and the house caught afire, and they came and got it out. Mr. Fry wasn't there. They came and got the fire out and I just didn't even get it straightened up or anything, but the girls was big enough then, they went ahead then and straightened pp the house. And we had an old neighbor that used to come to our place so much; he'd come down and stay with the children, He was a carpenter, when they were there he'd come down and they all liked him. So he came right down. I went up and stayed with this woman, helped take care of her, stayed with her. And this carpenter came down and it caught around the chimney, and they got it ou£ and of course, it left an awful mess, of course they used water to get it out- and he come down and fixed that and stayed with 'em- the children.
SS: Was that a chimney fire?
FVF: Yeah. No, it was burnt around, caught outside of the chimney, wasburnt around, burnt a hole around the chimney. But they got it out. The children were— there used to be a sawmill out from our place, out where I lived out by the schoolhouse, there was a sawmill right there, and there was oh, a half a dozen or so youngsters out there they was having a weinie feed, and I was settin' in the house, didn't notice anything, didn't smell anything and pretty soon here come a couple of 'em at the door, just like this you know, and they said "Ma ma our house is afire." And about that time the doctor called and said, "I'll be down by there in fifteen minutes." And he said, "We're on our way." So did- I had my stuff ready to go. And then one time we made a tr ip up to Cedar Creek, that's when we had snow too, good many years ago. And so I said to the doctor, "Now I don 't know what we're getting into, 'cause I've never been to this place in my life." Well, that day they had plowed the road. And of course, when they first started fixin' road , they'd only plow just- this is when they had cars and they'd only plow just wide enough for a car to go. Well if you got off of that where it had kinda got tramped down, you'd slide off here and you'd slide off there. Well, the doctor had to fight that car all the way up there and when he got to this place- when he got in the house he just loosened all of his clothes and he just wiped his face and neck ana^ he was just wringing wet with sweat. And the womanwell, she was going to have her baby alright, but it took all night. So we played cards til five o'clock! And then the baby was born, and doc took off and I stayed there and took care of her.
SS: Just you and the doctor played cards?
FVF: No, she played, too! Her and her husband, and we all played. (Chuckles)And laugh, I never laughed so in my life, because, I forget- the doc tor was playing I guess with her husband and - I think she was my pardner and he had kept all of his aces, you know, but he didn't keep anything to save those aces. Here he played the wrong one the first time, that is, he played something that we got the lead and I lead him out of his aces, and oh, we had more fun with that. Because he was so sure he had all-
SS: The doctor?
FVF: Yes. The doctor.
SS: What game was this that you were playing?
SS: Pinochle, yeah.
FVF: And oh, we used to have a lot of fun like that!
SS: When he was delivering the baby, what would you do? What would yourjob be?
FVF: Well, I'd just be there to hand him the different things that he wanted.And then soon as the baby was born and he'd tied the cord, then I?d have to take it and wash it and dress it.
SS: Was he cool?
FVF: Yes, never saw him excited in my life. And very nice to be with, justvery nice.
SS: Were there ever any difficult births that they did?
FVF: Yes, we had one: my daughter-in-law. She had a bad one, but we hada nurse there and all with us and she had a real hard time. And it took a long time for the baby to get here and after it was over with) my son said to me, "Mama," he says, "how come that you ever took on anything like this?" He says, "I don't know how you stand it." I said, "Well," I said, "I don't like it, but," I said, "I always was paid for it, you know.^ So, I was glad to get the money." That was enough for him, he sure was wore out after we got through because it just took everyone of us, and one of us'd first hold her and .another and another. She had an awfully hard time. And her mother was there, but she says, "I'll go over and take care of the children." 'Cause you see they lived right close to me, and she says, "I'll go over and cook for the children, take care of them, if you'll just take care of Wilda." So we stayed with Wilda then. And she took care of the children. Took quite a while, but, she finally- that was her first one, and she had a real hard time. The other ones she had, she didn't have a bad time with them at all. She's got five- four boys and a girl; and they're all grown.
SS: What was it like during the Depression years for you' and your family?Were you doing some of this stuff during that time, there in the '30's? Was it a hard time?
FVF: Well, I don't know's it was any harder than any other time, as far asI was concerned. We always took our grain- we had raised grain. And at that time, why, we'd take our grain down to Pataha down here and have it made into flour and then we'd get our- all the course stuff and everything, you know, to use that we were used to using- we'd get all that stuff- We had all of that stuff and practically all we had to buy was coffee and sugar, because we had our own flour. And then we had our own meat. And I canned lots of fruit. Just lots and lots of fruit. And I don't know if it was any harder than any other time. Maybe there was things that we'd like to had budLre couldn't have it, so what was the use to want it. We had other things to eat and we al ways had plenty to eat. The hardest thing we had, one time years ago, potatoes got up to five and six dollars a sack, and with all the chidren, you know, they liked potatoes, and Mr. Fry, he didn't like beans, but he ate 'em. We had beans, we ate beans. I don't like 'em either,
SS: Five and six dollars' how big a sack would that be? A hundred pounds?
FVF: Yeah: And it didn't take our family long to eat a hundred pounds, because we all ate potatoes, when we had 'em. But that was the hardest thing I think we had to get when we were*pretty short on money, was these potatoes. But I had rice and other things that I used but they couldn't eat that all the time.
SS: What kind of pay did you get for work in the camps? In the loggingcamps?
FVF: Well, let's see, I got around- oh, I'd say, around five dollars a day,I don't know. Don't remember.
SS: When did you start doing that? Was that in the '30's, that you startedcooking for them? Or later?
FVF: Oh, I don't know.
SS: You still had kids, though?
SS: Oh, yes, the children- When I first started I had been around town herethen, I'd been around town here, working here in town- . But the '30's must have been long before we come down here wasn't it? are
SS: How old your younger kids?
FVF: My young one's around forty, and the oldest one's I think sixty five.
SS: Well, it could have been in the '40's there, up in there.
FVF: But, we never went hungry* That was one thing, you know, wehad milk and we had butter and we had eggs, and we got our coffee, we got our sugar. We didn't have a great lot of sugar, but we didn't suf fer any for that. And then we had our own flour from our mill.
SS: You working out so much, I'm just really impressed by how much you didin different places. Like you worked in town, too, at stores, eh?
FVF: Yes. When we first came downtown here, I worked in Long's over here andthen I worked at Blewitt's, and I think I worked for Marvin Long for ten years. And then I worked for Blewitt up here for ten or twelve years, then I went to the Forestry and worked for about twelve years in the Forestry.
SS: The Forestry being, what?
FVF: Up on Moscow Mountain where I was— well, I went from place toplace. I was up on Moscow Mountain for several years. I was in that ten years.
SS: As a lookout?
FVF: Yes. Not at the Lookout, I was crew. See,. I had anywhere from—Oh, sometimes I'd have two or three boys, sometimes I had half a dozen. Then when they worked on the roads up there, I'd have extra men on that, or if they put somebody up there putting in some different things, why, I'd have them to cook for. I had a cookshack. Trailer house. First year or two I was up there they had one of these great big maroon colored tents- army tents- And then I think it was ten years- eleven years, something like that I worked for them- for the Forestry, and had these boys. I loved that, and I loved those kids everyone of 'em. (Chuckles) Whole bunch of boys. I've got kids around here, boys that was on that Forestry Department that we sure did- Dr. Christiansen's boys- he had three boys- they were on my crew, his brother, and oh, the. boy a lot of boy s around here. They all know me.
SS: — helping in the community- I mean helping, people. Seems that's alot of what you did, wound up helping other people.
FVF: Well, I did a lot of that, as much as I could, wherever I could helpanybody, I'd go help 'em. Sometimes there'd be, oh, it would just come handy to do it. Like we went down and helped this man- I forget how many thousand turkeys he raised, and he had a bunch that he got off before Christmas, and then had another bunch that come on, well, some time after the first of the year. And the ones that weren't quite ready before Christmas, why, he took 'em and he took *em to Spokane and sold em. They were good neighbors,^lovely neighbors. But they moved away from up there.
SS: You didn't mind working out of home, being away from home?
FVF: Well, there's a lot of times I'd rather been at home, but then when Icould get this money, and he wasn't working, so I'd go and work.
SS: What happened with him? Was he getting older?
FVF: Oh, he wasn't one of those kind that was too ambitious, you might say!He thought he worked awful hard!
SS: He really preferred to stay at home?And read. Things like that. And then he'd finally- Well, he didn't want me to work either, but I didn't see any reason for me to set around here to do without everything- I didn't have anything much and I didn't see any reason to set around and do nothing when I could get this work and have a few things that Iwant. I didn't have a bathtub, I didn't have a- just different things like that that Iwanted. And then we fixed up the house and different stuff like that. Well, I couldn't have^it only just go out and get it. So that's what Idone. Oh, some times he got pretty mad at me, but then Icouldn't help it. Ijust asked the boys after they got older, why, I just asked them and the girls, they were all willing to go ahead and do at home if Igot this work to do outside. And then when they got old enough, why they went to work, too.
Was there much on the farm that he could have got very much off theland?
Oh, yes, he was apretty good farmer. But he wouldn't stay at it longenough. He'd just put it in, and if he wanted- well, if he had a lit tle money, extra money, why, if he needed this this or needed that, why, if he needed a piece of machinery of some kind, why he'd go and get that machinery. Well, I could wash on the washboard then! I didn't get this stuff. Then later years, I got me one of these- well, with my childrens' help, I got me one of these Maytag washers. I had that when we first come down to town here , and thent changed it from an engine to electricity down here. But I didn't- for years and years I didn't have a washer only just a hand washer.
SS: You know, it seemstLike nowdays that women are working out and bringinghome money, things for themselves and their side of th e family deal, that seems a lot more accepted now than I think maybe it was, you know, fifty, sixty, seventy-five years ago. Do you think that's true? Seems that's what women are doing now-
Well, I'll tell you now, they pretty near have to, the way things arenow. Just like I say, these kids that get married now they think they have to have a refrigerator and all these appliances; everything. Which is handy, of course, but land sake, we never had anything like that. We was lucky to have a table and chairs and things like that. They want everything. And when they get that they get out- some of 'em'll get out and work for it and others'11 just buy and buy and the first thing you know they've lost it all and they have to start over again. They don't figure, "Well, how'm I going to pay for it?" Well, I never got anything but what I figured I had to work to pay for it. I got, oh, I don't know, my first electric stove and my bathtub and my hotwater tank and numerous things like that, he didn't make enough for us to have those things, because he didn't work enough. He didn't like it because I went out to work lot of times at all, but I talked to the boys about it. They said, "Go ahead." Sometimes he got awful mad about it, but then I just couldn't help it, because I figured that I wanted those things and I was going to have 'em, so I just got out and rustled.
SS: Do you think that any of the neighbor women envied the fact that youcould just go out and work like that?
SS: Seems like-
FVF: No, there was three or four women around here at the time that I worked around town, there was about three women of us and we'd first one then another and then another, and we could all of us have work. And if I got more than I could do then I'd tell one of the other girls and they'd go and do this other work and we kinda worked together that way. And now, you can't get anybody like that. You just can't hire anybody. You can't hire anybody to come and stay with you, or anything like that. They won't do it.
They get their social security, some of 'em. Some of 'em are living offa- that's what I don't like about this welfare. Of all things that they say Carter is cutting down on, and all like that- I don t know why in the world he don't see into some of that. Some of those people - has been generations- has just been on welfare. Now, there's no sense in that. There's a man up here that I know- I knew his father well, he was on my crew at the mill- sawmill- and I cooked at sawmills, too. He got a chance.
And they were in my crew at the sawmil he was not too old then, buthe's up in years now himself, he's past sixty, and so he got a chance to buy him a place up here over on Crescent side, over past Cedar Creek, you go to Cedar Creek and then go round toward Southwick;wellj he's over there and he bought this place, but after he— now, his folks wasn't any people to go to school or anything like that, but he did go to For estry Service after he got out of school, and he took Forestry. Well, he worked for the Forestry Department for- I don't think he's working for 'em any more. But anyway, he bought this place, and I went up past there last summer- went up jhast there, went huckleberrying, and come back by there and I saw that place and I said something to some body about it, and they said it belonged to this boy. And h - is going to work, now just himself, he has, oh, he has a bulldozer and he has this and he has that and things to do with. He got him a nice big tr ailer house and he put it up or this place and he built him anice barn. I didn't get to see all of it, but I think he built him a nice barn, and you know he's cleaning up all along there, just cleaning up under all of those trees and everything, just cleaning everything all out. It reason looks like a park. And I said, there's no. in this world all of this help - that they hand out that money to those people that could be out there cleaning up this land and straightening that up, that we could have a paradise. And still they'd get their money and be working for it, and instead of that they just hand it to them! Welfare'. And so I want to go up this summer- this Christmas- there's about four boys up there that Iknew their folks well. And so, for Christ mas I made each one of those boys a fruit cake and sent it to them for their Christmas.
If Iunderstand what you're saying- the money that you made, that moneywent to make some improvements that you wanted on the house.
SS: is that mostly what it did?
SS: Hot water heater, and that kind of thing? So you paid for that stuffyourself then, really?
FVF: Yes. Most of it.
SS: Did you move from- when did you finally move from Cedar Creek tocloser to town here?
FVF: Well, we moved from Cedar Creek down here when Nellie was- let's seeshe's forty something now- We must have moved down here, oh, let's see, - well, I can't just exactly say, but we've been down here-
SS: What was it that made you decide to make the move?
FVF: Well, he was renting his mother's place. Mr. Fry was renting his mother's place. Well, every year it was the same thing over and over and over and over. Well, him and her never got along. He couldn't get along with his mother and she couldn't get along him, but still he stayed there on that ranch. And she'd keep asayin'- talkin' to me about this and that. Well, she would lend him money and then she got to where she'd come back onto the children and I for that money. And I said, "Well," I said, "" you let him have that money," I said, "You get that money from him." I said, "You're not going to get it off of us." And so I took my money, what I got, and I put it into my house. Well, if he wanted a piece of machinery, if he had the money to get it, he'd go and get the piece of machinery. Well, maybe the kids needed shoes, but they didn't get 'em. And things like that. And I was pretty near forced to, in a way. To get 'em- that is to have the children have anything, or me or anybody else, because he didn't make though. jje was a good farmer, but then he didn't go to it like the other farmers did- There's several other boys up there that was about his age and everything, well they made good on those farms up there. But then he wouldn't deny himself anything to try to make good.
SS: So, did he finally then give up the place?
FVF: She finally I told her, I said, one time, she had quite a littleI said, "just as soon as he finds a place for me to move," I said, " "I'll move." So it come time for-
FVF: They had graduated. Then there was two going to school down here.School hire. And so, we were to- he was going to get off the ranch. She wanted the ranch, so he was going to get off. Well, he fooled around and fooled around and it came time to move and everything and it wasn't schooltime and he wasn't going to move. So I said, "Now you said you'd move." Well, we got this little place^there. It wasn't nothing but a rock pile. just a rock pile with little housed But we got it and that's where we lived. And we just didn't have any conve niences, you might say, at all. But we lived there and then I got to work, and I got work here any place, and then I had a cow for quite a long while. I kept a cow and we sold milk. But, of course then, after wards, later on, you had to have pretty near a parlor for your cow and everything, and Icouldn't do that so I^got rid of the cow. Well, then I worked-
SS: You had to have a what for the cow?
FVF: A parloH You pretty near had to have a parlor before youcould sell milk. You know, you had to have- well, just so it would be alright, you know, to - they had to test everything and everything just so. Which is alright, but then at that time, why, they wasn't doing that stuff, but^that's what it come to before I got through sel ling milk. So then I had that milk. I sold milk. And then- I had one boy, one - the youngest boy, and he could always find something to do. They to laugh about this, they said, he'd go out and hit some body up to polish their shoes or he'd hit 'em up to do this or do that, and if he couldn't get a dime he'd take a nickle. Arid all such stuff as that! (Chuckles) And that's what he did. He was just a little kid but he's done it all his life. So, anyway, Iworked then. And I got to work in the store over here and I worked first one place and then another, and then I was working at Marvin Long's- the Long Brothers was the Long Company, he was the- and he just sold out here a few a year, years ago. He's still alive, he's^younger than I am, Marvin is. He's always been good to me and my family. And so this deal come up about cooking for the boys in the Forest. But all this other cooking I done I'd done that before. That was when we lived out there, before I left Cedar Creek- or no, when we first come down. But I was working for this Marvin, and I didn't get- I forget what I got down there,flso much a week. And so this fella come to me and he says, "Say, I need a cook." No, he said, "I wish I'd known you'd cook." or something like that. And I said, Why?" And he said, "I'd a come and ask you to coojc for the crew." He had a crew and he wanted somebody to cook for 'em. Well, this woman was a schoolteacher that he'd asked and she was going to come. Well, this was on Saturday and by Monday morning she'd deci ded that she didn't want to, so this fella called me, and he said he wanted me to cook. And I said, "Well, when do you want me?" He says, "I want you right now." So I got ready. And that was my first that I'd went out like that with the boys, you know, I had these boys to cook for.
SS: Did you have a tent there?
FVF: When I first went out, I did. And then we got a little t railerhouseand then they got me a bigger trailerhouse. I think it was eleven years I worked for them. For the state. And I cooked for the boys and the state paid me, and then the boys - they would take things from home and bring things in, you know, and then I could order my things and then they'd divide^ , how many was there. They'd divide it in so many parts, and each one paid the grocery bill. And for years I served their meals at two bits a meal. And before we got through why it was about seventy-five. And the boys were always- I never heard but one or two boys ever say anything- might say, "Well, now, does this satisfy you?" Or do you want this or do you want that. And so once in a while I would- oh, a little later on- they liked milk so well but that was pretty expensive to buy milk,. And then the bears got to getting milk. We'd set the milk- we had a little creek run down past there and it was so cold that you couldn't keep your hand in the water, but just a little bit.
And the boys' say , "Well, now, whoever cankeep your hand in there the longest get a nickle," And they'd get their hand in the water and then they*d have to pay one another, you know. Well, the bears kept getting it. I said, "Well," I said, "I can get you the milk, but," I says, "it's pretty expensive." Well, they got to drinking feool- Aid and stuff like that. Then finally we got a gas refrigerator. And after I got my gas refrigerator- I didn't have anything to keep meat or anything like that up there, you know, any kind of meat it was hard to keep and then we got the gas refrigerator and then I. Then I'd always get something- they always put up their lunches and so then I'd get something extra- I'd get OP it myself and take it't We, cause it didn't take very much. I'd get. oh, candy bars and oranges and bananas and stuff like that. And one week I'd get one thing and one week another, you know. Then on Friday nights we'd usually come home- on Friday nights- so for Friday evening's supper- or dinner and supper- why, I'd get steak, and we'd have steak for supper, and all the things that went with it. I never heard any complaints. They clean up everything. I never saw such kids in my life.
SS: You said you relly loved that. Why did you enjoy it so much?I'd love
FVF: Well,because I was up there and I love the timber. to be inthe timber right now. I was up in the timber a week ago, spent the day, week ago tomorrow. And it was one of those days, just like this. And the snow was practically gone, and it was just lovely. And up on the mountain there, and that's a beautiful mountain to be up there in the summertime. And I just loved it there, and I had all this good water and everything. Then we had birthdays. And they finally built a pond. We used to go down to the Palouse River every night or two. The boys'd take a notion they'd go down there - swim. Well, I al ways went with them, they wanted me to go, and I'd always go with them. We'd go down there and they'd swim and swim and then they'd come back. Well, they finally built a pond, so when it come anybody's birthday, why, they had to catch him and throw him in- and we'd do that, you know. And then we'd pick huckleberries. We'd go out and pick huckleberries and then I'd make pies for them. And then when the birds got big enough, why, they'd get the birds. They said, now, if we get the birds, will you cook 'em for us? And I said, "Yes." I said, "you get the birds and I'll cook 'em. So we had bird to eat. Then one time we had the porcupines. They were just thick one year. So somebody told the boys that porcupines was good to eat. So they asked me one day, they said, "If we klllk porcupine, will you cook it?" I said, "If you boys'11 dress it," I said, "I'll cook it." So I cooked 'em a porcupine. It wasn't bad at all. It's just about like pork, and the boys liked it. You wouldn't like it for a steady diet or anything, but they all liked it and they all ate it and thought it was good. Oh, we used to have a lot of fun. The boys was so good, they were all good boys.
SS: This be for the wholevummer?
SS: The whole summer?
SS: Up on Moscow Mountain mostly?
FVF: Just- you know the cedar grove was?
SS: Oh, yes.
FVF: Well, I was right down there. And there was a big tree there that, oh,it had a big burl on it. And, oh, I wanted the boys to get that burl for me so bad, you know. But therewasn't any way really possible for 'em to get it because it was up quite a ways. And the last time I asked the fellow- the overseer of that stuff now, the last time I was out, well, I talked to him pretty near every day, and I'd ask him about that. And he said that somebody'd cut that tree and took that burl. I bet it was that big around. Off'n the tree.
SS: Did you really like horses when you were young?
FVF: Yes. I always had a horse. I'd love to have one today. If I had onetoday, I'd ride it. I just love horses. I told 'em, if they'd give me a horse and saddle and the stuff.1 want for my horse, I said, they could all have their cars tht wanted 'em; I'd take the horse.
SS: When you were a kid did you have your own horse?
FVF: Yes. We had horses when I was little, oh, about this small, and thenI always had a horse to ride after I was grown up and then I worked with horses. I drove horses and everything else after we was married. I had. access to horses all my life. I just love 'em. I just love to go to these horse- fairs and things see these horses. I just luve a beauti ful horse. I had different ponies. We had some that was real nice ponies, and some wasnt so good. But always had something to ride, and I Loved it.
SS: Did you take care of the horses on the farm?
FVF: I did, when it worked out .: way, I took care of 'em. Like my daughterdown here, they come here- this outfit down here bought a ranch over on Salmon River, and they were having such a horrible time getting anybody to go over there to work that knew how to put a harness on a horse or anything like that, they didn't know how. They couldn't find anybody that knew how, so she told the boss, she says, "Well, I know somebody that can harness a horse." He laughed and he said, "Who?" And she says, "My Mom." And I'd a just loved to went over there and harnessed those horses. (Chuckles) But they finally found somebody, I guess.
SS: Did they forget how to do that already?
FVF: Well, that's what this- supposedly this school down here was to be, youknow, all that stuff. It started out alright but then they didn't carry it out. She worked awful hard at it. This Mrs. over there that made this cookbook. Well, there just isn't anything in that cook book- I don't know of anything in that cookbook that I didn't already know. I worked over there^quite a while in it. And she was trying to do, and it's alright, but she didn't go at it- that is, like she should have. Just like I said, she made so much on that first, before she sold her right- she made so much on that- you know, if it'd been me, I'd a took part of that and saved it somewhere that I'd a had something out of it. Now she may lose the whole thing. That's what's too bad about it.
SS: I was going to ask you about— I know that during World War I, thatthere was some pretty bad feelings against the German people, like at Cameron, you know, in there, because they were saying that they weren't supporting the war enough and that kind of thing. Do you re member that, at that time?
FVF: Well, I remember them talking about it. They was some people upthere that- well, all I know, is just what other people said; the|\~ neighbors said. But then all that I know- there's never been anything that those people- German people- up there ever did anything to hurt anybody in any way I don't know of anything. Well, it was just like it was- I was quite- during the war, you know, when they wasn't letting these people, like these Japanese- they were putting 'em in a- you know, a place, kind of a- well, just putting 'em in all of these camps and things like that. Well, now, there'd been those people down there in Emmett for years and years and years- had been there and they wonderful gardens and everything andAasked*nothing of anybody, and they didn't hurt anybody, and they waan't doing anything, and I never thought it was right that they ever put those people in camps when they stayed here and worked like they had. Why, I didn't think there was any use to have to watch 'em or anything, 'cause I don't think they was up to anything like that. And I don't think anybody was up here. They might a- oh, times- I do know, that there was one or two of these people that maxwell, all of these Germans that come in here, that live up there, they're all pretty well fixed, and all like that. But a lot of 'em - they helped- well, they send things to their folks that they have over there, why wouldn't they? And things like that, but that's all I ever heard.
SS: Do you think that they had a kind of bad- were unfairly taken tofor that? During that time?
FVF: Well, people might have just kind of shunned 'em or something like thatbut as far as I know, there never was anything drastic went on. Be cause I don't know why they should when they'd been here all these years and have always supported and done what they were supposed to do, and the way they was supposed to do. There's a lot of people that weren't Germans and like that, that they should have hung, where these people had always done what they should, and had always given and helped with all the different things around that was- like well, when you wanted any help for this or that or something else, they was always good to help.
SS: Did you run into the Indians at all when you were younger around here?
FVF: We used to have the Indians come by our place. We lived along the mainroad that went through from here clear to Elk River and summer they just just come through there and go up there and pick berries, you know, and things in the summer. And they used to stop at our place several of 'em. And like that, that's all we ever had to do with 'em. They never bothered us in any way. There was one man and hi s wife, they used to come in and eat with us, and like that. And then I know of people that has went over there around Kamiah, and over in there to see those people and I've known of 'em, they went over there and had meals with those Indians and all, and they enjoyed being with them, as far as I know. And this woman;she wasn't any hand to talk; he'd do the talking. She wasn't any hand to talk, but we had a- well, the folks needed a little more shelter of some kind for different things, and they'd put up a tent, and when she come and saw that tent at our place, why, she was so tickled, she just went down there and she just jabber, jabber, jabber to him about this tent, you know. But as far as having any real dealings with them, I never did. But there was some awfully nice ones that we used to talk to that come through here and from year to year we knew 'em, but otherwise than that, you had no dealings with them.
SS: Would you say that most of the people who were living on Cedar Creekwould- most of them in the early days, have very, very little money? Because I know elsewhere that was the case. Seems like people didn' have hardly any money.
FVF: Yes, I don't know of of 'em that had money. They got their moneyafter they left up there. They din't make any money up there, there was to be made. They just existed up there, as far as you could tell, you know. They just existed, but there's a lot of them people that done other things or did things or raised enough things or sold logs or done something like that, that they're pretty well fixed now. Some of the older families. Now there's the Lyonses - well then the Cuddy* t moved in here and different ones like that- 'course they're not really the old-timers. There's only about one or two of the oldtimers left, that's all. But these others are later, they come later. But they've all done well that's lived up there mostly.
SS: Off the land there? Right off that land?
FVF: Uh-huh. Some of 'em don't care to make anything. They don't care tobuild up anything- make anything. But the ones that do have- accumuatf lated more land and more, built a good house and got different things, why, that way they have done a lot of that. There's several that's up there that's- well, they're not rich, but^they're well-fixed.
SS: How much land does- did you have when you were farming and you livedout there?
FVF: Oh, let's see- we had- well, I don't really know- we had the wholeranch for a long time and then she sold part of it. There was, oh, maybe three hundred acres, something like that.
SS: Most of that cleared?
FVF: Well, yes, practically the whole place was cleared. But she sold abouthalf of it first and then she sold the other half to these Cuddys that come up from South Idaho. They starved out down there so they come up here and took ahold and rented and now they've got the whole country up there. Them and the Lyonses and some people by the name of Parsley
SS: Even though everybody was poor, you know, more or less, I mean as faras money goes in those days, were there some people that would act like they had money? Or that would put on airs? You know what I mean?
FVF: No. Whenever anyone went out they usually had something maybe, a newdress or something, but otherwise than that they didn't make any show of anything like that. They wore the best they could and everybody was glad to see 'em, and we all just mingled together. We had literary and we had spelling bees and we had all that stuff that we went to, and parties, you know. And everybody went; took their kids and each fella'd take something to eat and we'd have a lunch and that's the way we'd go. Everybody'd go. And dancing. That was our entertainment and everything. But everything was free gratis, til later years and then in later years they got to being kind of snippy, but then—
SS: These parties you're talking about. Did they play party games at 'em?
FVF: Oh, yes. Yeah, they played- let's see- Jack-In-The-Box- (Chuckles)I don't know what the name of it was. We used to march around and have partners, and march around and they'd say, "Happy is the miller the mill boy." goes around and you'd change partners, and you know, just all those playing games like that. Because some of the church people wouldn't go to the dances, and then the other people- we'd go to the parties and we'd go to the dances, too, it didn't make any dif ference.
SS: Would these be at the schoolhouse?
SS: Would you have dances at the schoolhouse, too?
FVF: We had a downstairs and an upstairs.
SS: Sometimes there'd be a dance and sometimes it would be a party?
FVF: Well, they had this hall up above the schoolhouse, and then they'dhave these dances and parties in this hall and then sometimes we'd go to the houses before we had this hall. Well, it*s still standing there. They're fixing it up again, they want to re— they're thinking of reredo doing it, you know, and just leave it as it is only it. And because it needed a foundation and different things. So I don't know whether they're going to go ahead with that. They've been now for quite a while having different things and getting money to rebuild or some thing, so I don't know just what they'll do. Only so few up there anymore; they've all moved out or sold to different people. There's a big outfit come in over on- towards Boulder Creek there, and there's nobody up there on that place, and then the others have all gathered up anything around til theres not too many families there. But they are fixing- figuring on fixing up this schoolhouse.
SS: I was up there this summer and I just thought it was so beautiful upthere.
FVF: Oh, it is beautiful. I like it up there. We could have stayed there.I'd a liked to stayed there. I didn't want to stay there the way it was because- Well, Grandma lived with us all the time.
SS: His mother?
FVF: Yes. And she wasn't satisfied and I wasn't either, so— And I had—well, even with her, I could get along better with her than he did.
SS: Did she help you when she lived there?
FVF: Oh, she did til she got older and then when she got older, thenshe caused so much trouble between the children. I finally her that she had her part of the house. I told her to stay in there and what told the children to do I wanted them to do and for her to let 'em alone. And then she got to where she wasn't able to stay up there, fiter we left she tried to stay up there alone, but she couldn't. She finally went to Clarkston— yeah, Clarkston and was down there and she passed awy while she was down there.
SS: I think I should be going.
FVF: There was another lady up there- she wasn't a pioneer, but she cameshortly- well, she had her family along with my family- she married one of the boys from up there, and she was just a whizz. And I should have got together with her and- why we coulda written a- the greatest book from up on that ridge, I ever heard tell of if we'd of got together and done it, but she's past that now. She's in a home up there at Mos cow. And I just hated to think we never got together and did that. and Because she knew people I knew^people, and we could put it together and we could- well, we could tell everybody- when those places changed hands and everything up there. They stayed for,long, you know, that we could start from the first and we coulda went right through the whole thing- the whole thing down pat. But I just never did it. But I've sure berated myself. Some of these things that I read that, ones have written about, you know,- Now in fact, they was a fella here the other day that was talking and he got a little booklet from over at Boulder Creek, and this fella had given a little about Boulder Creek. Well, goodness sakes, I coulda told a lot more than he did in his book. It wasn't a real book, it was just a little pamphlet. And then he said he had another book- it's a fella that lives out here on Bear Ridge, and he said he'd bring it down to me and let me read it, so some of these days I'm gonna get that.
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10:00 - Her responsibility for chores; had cow that gave ten gallons of milk daily; how they acquired the cow
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29:00 - Women work harder than men. She worked in the field. She worked much harder than most women.
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41:00 - Woman teased her husband; never criticized others; father made children do work he wouldn't do
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